State Attorneys General to Target Global Warming 'Deniers'

Posted by $ nickursis 8 years, 7 months ago to Government
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Just as we discussed in the other thread about fraud on their side, they are now abusing the legal system to try to enforce their corruption and continue to loot what little is left. If they keep pushing, it will be more than a few cattle ranchers who decide enough is enough. They are really pushing the limits of overt dictatorship.
SOURCE URL: https://pjmedia.com/trending/2016/03/30/state-attorneys-general-to-target-global-warming-deniers/


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  • Posted by ProfChuck 8 years, 7 months ago
    What further evidence is needed to prove that AGW is a massive political scam? There is just enough science in their argument to make it sound plausible to the scientifically illiterate. For example, the claim that the science is settled is utter nonsense. Even Newtonian dynamics and Einstein's relativity are not considered to be settled by competent scientists so how could someone claim that AGW is settled and maintain a straight face? Climate dynamics is extraordinarily complex, far more so than the models used to describe it. Failure to take vegetation response to increased CO2 levels is just one example of how short AGW falls from being rigorous research. AGW is maybe 10 percent science and 90 percent politics and I am being generous.
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    • Posted by blackswan 8 years, 7 months ago
      Plant response is a good one, but an even bigger one is the SUN!!! How can one ignore the sun in a CLIMATE model?!?
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      • Posted by ProfChuck 8 years, 7 months ago
        Indeed. As an astronomer I recognize that the Sun is considered to be a variable star. While the variability is not large it is still enough to have significant impact on the dynamics of the ecosphere of the planet. Many of the fluctuations of solar emission have been observed to alter the thermal equilibrium of Venus, Mars and Jupiter as well a the Earth. The anthropogenic contribution to climate processes is only one of many factors that must be included in any realistic model.
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  • Posted by $ WilliamShipley 8 years, 7 months ago
    So, would we have the defense be able to challenge global warming in a court of law, and cross examine the AGW experts contrasting their public statements with subsequent events?
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    • Posted by $ jbrenner 8 years, 7 months ago
      I think that as power of attorney for my father, who worked for Mobil and thus has plenty of ExxonMobil stock, I would have standing in such cases against the state attorneys general and the Feds.

      Such a cross-examination would involve many questions from State of Fear by Michael Crichton, one of the books that should be on the Gulch reading list.
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      • Posted by $ 8 years, 7 months ago
        Well, JB, you may get a chance. I would even say you could be an example of either being "mislead" or feeling they kept you in the loop, which means you fall on one side or the other. I am pretty sure which side you are on here. i am amazed (not surprised) that they are wasting taxpayer money on this boondoggle, and if Oregon is in the crowd, may complain to state, for all the good it will do.
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    • Posted by $ 8 years, 7 months ago
      One would think whatever company they go after pools their money with the rest of the targets and makes sure all 18 are defeated next election. That would show them the power of money, and their supreme court says it's ok to do. Of course anyone fighting them should expose them to excruciating detailed questioning, and throw in all the possible factors causing climate change, as well as why they have not placed sanctions on countries cutting down all the rainforest, and China and Mexico for excessive pollution, CO2 contamination and just being pigs. I am so tired of the corrupt crap....
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  • Posted by teri-amborn 8 years, 7 months ago
    There is no such thing as "the environment" nor is there any such thing as "environmental rights".
    Denial of something that doesn't exist is rationality. Punishing people (or corporations) for what you feel that they should believe is complete nonsense.
    Why not being reality and reason into this "discussion" between the government and Exxon ... like Hank Rearden did?
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    • Posted by $ 8 years, 7 months ago
      Teri, I do not follow your statement of there is no such thing as "the environment". I am pretty sure that the surrounds of a human being constitutes their environment, as the term is used. Maybe you mean the way the enviro crowd uses it as a personal noun?
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      • Posted by teri-amborn 8 years, 7 months ago
        There isn't a generic: "environment". There is only: "Your environment" OR "My environment".
        There IS the earth...but that isn't an "environment".
        This need of the left to "socialize" and "generalize" definitions is what leads to such boundary-crossing violations of individual rights.
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        • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 8 years, 7 months ago
          I believe you two have hit upon one of the unstated problems. Differing definitions especially those that change willy nilly without explanation are not the sort of thing either side should reference as valid. We've had enough of that from 100 years of socialism. Congratulations and thumbs up to the both of you.
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          • Posted by $ 8 years, 7 months ago
            Indeed, that does seem to be one of the issues, without a rational definition of what is being discussed, it becomes moot, and just an exercise in assertion of authority. Which seems to be what they are doing here. Maybe the states are trying to emulate the Feds? I didn't look at the full list, but I have to wonder how many of these are Dumbocraps, and states aligned to them. Maybe it is indeed a case of collusion and pressure to make business comply?
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  • Posted by term2 8 years, 7 months ago
    I missed the part about how it's government that should even worry about such things as climate change. Each of us can worry about it if we want to and evaluate the effects on OUR individual lives. I live at 3000 ft elevation so sea level rise of a few feet isn't significant to me. If I lived at the beach it might be different and I might need to move by 2050.
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    • Posted by $ Olduglycarl 8 years, 7 months ago
      Interesting to note: This so called sea level rise is only on the east coasts of all continents and is a cycle that will cause sea level rise on the western sides of a continents eventually...

      "it's a cycle...silly" is my response and laughing at all the "chicken littles".
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      • Posted by term2 8 years, 7 months ago
        Maybe I am a bit case, but, it seems like the earth temp at any given time is a result of many competing factors and self stabilizing processes. The temp would naturally rise and fall in some sort of natural oscillatory pattern
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        • Posted by $ Olduglycarl 8 years, 7 months ago
          Exactly...and the sun drives those patterns.
          Recently, we're beginning to learn that climate science has gotten wrong, some of it is bad science, poor conclusions, missing information when the "scientific process" should always adapt to new knowledge and not try to make that new information to fit the old knowledge.

          Yes, the earth and it's natural systems is in fact amazing...those of us that just choose to look at whats there, what's happening are able to see just how amazing the nature of earth is.
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          • Posted by term2 8 years, 7 months ago
            Maybe I am not a nut case afterall
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            • Posted by $ 8 years, 7 months ago
              Nope you are not, but in their universe, you are both a nut and a criminal. I still am amazed the tree huggers have never invaded Bolivia and Brazil to stop the Amazon deforestation, which at least, has an arguable case for being a contributor to GW. These idiots just do what they always do, screw us, because they cannot tell others who are really doing it, because they just tell them to F@$K off.
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    • Posted by $ 8 years, 7 months ago
      I also think it is just cover for a way to exercise more control. The sheeple are so stupid that all they have to do is be told the sky is falling to believe it. The government wouldn't ever lie, would it?
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      • Posted by term2 8 years, 7 months ago
        You hit it right on the head. There is a blind faith in government here, no matter how badly it performs
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        • Posted by mccannon01 8 years, 7 months ago
          Boggles the mind. It seems when I was young and T-Rex was still walking the earth, the left was making war on the government, now the left is the government and is moving more left.
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          • Posted by term2 8 years, 7 months ago
            Which leads into how is it going to be possible to break this progression to socialism or do just have to get to a total collapse of the society as in AS and in Venezuela today
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            • Posted by mccannon01 8 years, 7 months ago
              "...how is it going to be possible to break this progression..."? Now there's the trillion dollar question. I don't really have a working answer, but wish I did. Nickursis elsewhere in this thread said "It is something inherent in the sheeple. In the DNA..." and I think he may be on to something there. That is, if the given is the human species survives best when it uses its rational mind, then refusal to use rational thought (or loss of rational thought ability) will call upon "mother nature's evolutionary engine" to cull the bad DNA out of the species or the species goes extinct. This could be very nasty business as those who use rational thought to learn the lessons of history well know.

              Maybe the start of a solution to save this republic is to find a way to massively kick start rational thought in the minds of the "sheeple". Now, convincing people that what they "know absolutely" is false is not an easy job. The first step, I suppose, is to make sure what you "know absolutely" is true.
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              • Posted by $ 8 years, 7 months ago
                Therin is the problem, we have raised a few generations of sheeple that have had it embedded in their DNA that everything is summed up in a 30 second statement, that you go with your "feelings" and that you have some inalienable right to total security and "safe space" any where, any time. Those same people who raised those sheeple are the ones we are confronting today. I cannot believe anything but this has been a long term, planned thing, and I think Ayn Rand thought so too. It is the basis for AS, only she did not delve into how it got there, just that it did, and was trying to warn us of the fact we were on the road even back then.
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                • Posted by mccannon01 8 years, 7 months ago
                  I see what you are saying here, but I'm not so sure it was planned as in a massive conspiracy. I think more like "birds of a feather flock together", but they flocked in the media and the schools and universities and the results is what we have. Same results, but not necessarily planned and the degradation continues by feeding itself.
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                  • Posted by $ 8 years, 7 months ago
                    I think there are some facts that will support the theory, in taht most of the secret organozations hide their agendas and purposes, and memberships. Groups that are above board have no need to. Also, I read (but have no proof) the Rockefeller both funded the CFR and donated the land for the UN. Seems like a systemic push in one direction...
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              • Posted by term2 8 years, 7 months ago
                Maybe it will take a collapse as in atlas shrugged to wake people up to the idea that socialism is flawed and individualism is better. Maybe it can be done one step at a time. Uber is better and cheaper than state supported taxi monopolies. Airbnb is cheaper than big hotels. Etc
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                • Posted by mccannon01 8 years, 7 months ago
                  "Maybe it will take a collapse...". I used to think the same thing and people will wake up, but now I think it more likely you'll see an intensification of what we are already seeing. The collapse will be blamed on those "greedy capitalists" or those "hateful republicans" or those "white racist slavers" because that is all the sheeple "know absolutely" to be true. A strong dose of rational thinking is the only way out of this and I think there is a shortage of that and it's getting more scarce yet.
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                  • Posted by term2 8 years, 7 months ago
                    I agree it will have to get very bad, as it did in AS, and now in Venezuela. Its incredible Maduro isnt just killed off to destroying a country as he has. But, the people there I have concluded are just stupid and ignorant and support him !!!! I guess it has to get a lot worse before they realize that socialism is whats responsible for their problems. I agree that its rational thinking that will fix this, and it "sort of" happened when the British went way too far with the colonists here and there was a revolution that spawned our constitution. When the British made the colonists pay for the war against the french, that was the straw that broke the camels back as it were. I wonder what will be necessary this time.

                    We can see it forming with the generalized upset and anger that Trump has identified. People are tired of the politicians that lie and manipulate for their own advantage. I have to hand it to Trump for putting up his own money to run against the establishment. They are taking him apart one day by the next to protect their "fiefdoms", and he keeps on standing up for us. He really doesnt have a lot to gain from all this. He already made his money and fame. Maybe, just maybe, he really believes in trying to make america great again. I give him the benefit of the doubt actually.
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                    • Posted by $ 8 years, 7 months ago
                      Term, you only have to look to Cuba for how a state can control it's people, all the protests during Obamanations visit were not reported, as they were against the government. The protestors were hauled away, and you will not see them again. This is what Hillary and Bernie offer the country. Venezuela is also a mess, but the people there still remember prosperous times.
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                      • Posted by term2 8 years, 7 months ago
                        I watched Obama go after Snowden God hath no fury than Obama scorned. The people of Cuba put Castro in. Now they reap the results. Same with Venezuela. Failur of the country is never the fault of socialism, only the incorrect implementation of it. Amazing
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                        • Posted by $ 8 years, 7 months ago
                          Be careful here. I am not sure you will win fans wit that statement. I would say no one in the forum will endorse socialism as anything but a legitimate from of dictatorship of the state. There can be no "correct" implementation of it, it is inherently flawed. Look at Sweden and their brief (40 years or so) fling with it, they fired the social democrats who ruled for 40 years and brought their conservatives back.
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                          • Posted by term2 8 years, 7 months ago
                            I agree totally. The claim that the failures of socialism are just due to faulty implementation is the excuse statists use. I think socialism is inherently flawed and can never work. There is a saying that socialism only works until the other guys money runs out. Sure was true in Venezuela !! The oil money ran out and socialism with it.
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                            • Posted by $ 8 years, 7 months ago
                              Now that is clearer, and true. Socialism is just a case of politicians and dictators covering up their agenda with "political" excuses. Until it implodes, and it does seem to do so regularly..
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                              • Posted by term2 8 years, 7 months ago
                                Venezuela cant last much longer without toilet paper. Something will happen there, and that one took 17 years from the start of Chavez until now
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                                • Posted by $ 8 years, 7 months ago
                                  The TP crisis was a couple years ago, I am pretty sure they got past it. last crisis was people buying airline tickets to cash back in. Just like Russia, you do weird things and make money in a dysfunctional system.
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                                  • term2 replied 8 years, 7 months ago
  • Posted by $ Abaco 8 years, 7 months ago
    Of course. Any surprise? This is just the start. There is at least one other topic they'll use to go after people. The American public is ready for this. Time to pounce...
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  • Posted by Dobrien 8 years, 7 months ago
    Power is of two kinds. One is obtained by the fear of punishment and the other by acts of love. Power based on love is a thousand times more effective and permanent then the one derived from fear of punishment.Ghandi
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    • Posted by $ 8 years, 7 months ago
      Love is an emotional tool used by the "others" to manipulate and control. There is no such thing as a "group love" that is successful because of the individual nature of each persons perception. No politician ever "loved his country", he loved the power, and the money, but not the country. Michael is spot on in his point of truth and facts , which then allow for rational thought and decision, is the only way to good decisions. That, though requires critical thinking and rational thought, which has been bred out of the sheeple, just look at them, and their purely emotional responses.
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    • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 8 years, 7 months ago
      Power based on facts not bull shit is a thousand times more effective and permanent. Except to those who expect and deserve nothing beyond minimal or non-existent standards. In which case they deserve what they get and richly deserve.
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