I have observed that those that are called creative or indicative names will not contribute to any discourse, pro or con...they just repeat their rehearsed mantra. Be reminded that these people are considered "Elite", YOUR rulers or Godly Celebrities to be followed by puppy dogs and sheep. I prefer to tell it like it is. Most of these people are parasitical humanoids...parasitical describes itself while humanoids are non conscious entities with no conscience, not aware of their own behavior and have no mutuality with the human race...another word for them would be: The Great Unwashed. No conscious human would assume power over another like they do, all the while it's clear that they have no talent but to make you think they do.
Would you still be respectful to someone that clearly does not respect you?
I'll agree, face to face...I'd love to say: "But I don't think of you, Mr Toohey."
Not so much and opinion but an observation and study over 10 years into the history of the rulers of mankind for the past 8000 years.
Mankind's evolution into Conscious Introspection, something 60% of the population still has not achieved...including the majority of the "Ruleless" Delete class.
I was called stupid here last week. It didn't really contribute to the conversation, now that you mention it. Haven't noticed much of that here, really.
I am sorry to hear that, Abaco. Nobody deserves that, and you are right, it doesn't contribute to the discussion. It actually shuts it down.
I guess what I am trying to say about name calling is this: To me, if someone wishes to talk about a political leader, use their name as it is, not some made-up disparaging name. Why does it have to be insulting moniker? Am I making any sense here? Commander? edweaver? AJAshineoff? Abaco?
Perfect sense. When I see the following posted here: Leftist, Democrap.Hildebeast, .....etc, I reflect to one of my favorite TV characters......Archie Bunker. I cannot help but feel sorry for the conditions that bring about the derisive, separatist terms. I do understand the source. Emotional expression of frustration and ignorance and condition of self esteem. Janet Hagberg's "Real Power" and Morris Massey video lecture, if you can get a copy, "What You Are Is Where You Were When", are clear expressions of the development of values, self worth and self esteem. I, and many others here will not be drawn down into the emotional fray.....it's not reasonable. LOL
Right. Now I do find some of those names amusing, but still, I try not to do it myself. It lowers the tone of the site, It means I cannot quote that thread/post to someone outside.
Thanks for responding. Personally, I think it lowers the tone of the site, too, but then I don't use them. Never have, never will although there are some politicians I don't care for.
Me the ad hominem dino, encouraged for listening to Rush since the Nineties and who delights in calling a bad King Barry thing an Obamanation and delights in calling curs Porking Piglosi, Cackles Clinton The Evil Hag and a certain Adam a sorry little Schiff, hereby advises that I just turned the zero someone gave you into a 1. Why? You're fully entitled to the opinion you just gave.
Yeah, some o y'all need ter lighten ther hell up! Yeehaw! Dinos just wanna have fun, yeah, dinos just wanna have fun. Hey, hell's bell! where'd ah git thet thar from? Oh, yeah~~https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIb6A... Hey, wait a dern minute! Ah ain't no dad-blamed girl.
I listened to Rush back in the Nineties as well. I guess thanks are in order, allosaur for allowing me to have my opinion noted. Actually, I didn't notice the thumbs down (0 points). You can't please everyone.
In my past I have uttered a string of epithets that can burn concrete. I've made terrible decisions in expression. I have been so fortunate, from my early learning, that I have not demeaned another seriously enough, that apology was not accepted.
I too chuckle at the creativity to bring some of these .....expressions....... to bear. I also laugh in relief at how ignorant I have been and that I have rectified ....most...of my behaviors. I am fallible, everything is learned. I am ignorant of many things. To take pride in ignorance is Stupid.
Exactly, Commander! I hate seeing those derisive and other names used and that is when I go away from the not-so-civil discourse. Abaco, I would like to chuckle about it, but it is no longer humorous to me. It seems like the rational mind we all claim to have is hijacked by the language spewed forth. Yet, everyone here within this thread has been polite and making sense. Further,everyone of you has managed to be civil throughout (thank you for that), but can it be sustained in all the forum threads?
It seems to me that as soon as separatist terms (as you called it Commander) are used, the rationality of the arguments go out the window. Moreover, it almost leaves no room for any kind of dissenting opinion as one would be called out (as Abaco was irrationally called stupid).
We all are fans of Ayn Rand and Atlas Shrugged or otherwise we wouldn't be here, so is it too much to ask for polite civility even if we don't particular care for any one politician/person?
Thank you all for weighing with rational thoughts.
You started the civilty,,,,beginning with a question rather than an assertion. A pointed example from the band Disturbed: Make sure the lyrics are close at hand. https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...
Commander, I try to be civil, but I don't always accomplish it. I will have to check out those lyrics. I am not familiar with that band. Thanks for the link.
Disturbed is a group of heavy metal protest-ants regarding many of the inequities we see in our culture. The song "Savior of Nothing" is very descriptive of explaining uncivil talk and action.
Although it was obvious that Ayn Rand did not like certain characters, she rarely evoked name calling or nicknames in her novels and other writing. Not by her characters (for example, Howard Roark's response to Ellsworth Toohey was that he didn't even think of him).
I’d just like to point out that Ayn Rand used her character’s names very effectively to build characterization and help her readers to form a mental construct of who they were. Ellsworth Toohey doesn’t exactly evoke strength and decency, does it? But Howard Roark does. How about Cuffy Meigs? Wesley Mouch? Sound like mooch? How bout John Galt? That’s a tough guy. As to name calling, sometimes you just have to call it like it is. I wouldn’t call anyone on this site a name, but I sure love me some political name calling!
To me it depends on context and what is being conveyed. A "snotty nickname" in one context might be just plain mean and in another it may be a simple tool to underscore a snippet of humorous sarcasm, especially in politics. It's part of the diversity of our culture as a caricature expressed in words rather than an image. It's nothing new as graffiti scrawled on walls in ancient Rome, Greece, and Egypt attests (I wish I could remember the book I saw examples in, but the Romans were particularly nasty - and hilarious!).
With that said, I totally agree with civil discourse between people having a conversation on various forums, including this one. There is no reason for the folks that come here to be mean to each other in that way. However, there have been many examples of humorous/affectionate name calling between participants here in the Gulch. We all "get it" and have a good time.
Thanks for your answer. Well, based on my interpretation of what you have written is that you and Olduglycarl think it is okay to use "snotty nicknames" because it is all in good fun and it is just the way it is.
Fair enough. I asked the question so I accept your answers especially considering that it has been civil discourse.
"...it is okay to use "snotty nicknames" because..." Your interpretation would be more accurate if written this way: "...it is okay to use "snotty nicknames" in proper context because...". Context is very important to convey humor, sarcasm, irony, etc. and not just ignorant confrontational meanness.
I think Hitlery's comment about deplorables makes her fair game, too. Perhaps if people stopped calling looters names, they'd focus their anger in more productive ways, like some people did in 1776.
So, no one called Hillary Clintor that moniker that you just used here on this site prior to when she called some people's actions deplorable? And no, I didn't like her name-calling either. I thought it just as rude then; I also won't stoop to using any similar names for anyone else..
Yes, people already had plenty of good reasons to express their opinions about her evil activities long before this Gulch even existed. I don't know when that moniker started, but I'l keep using it because it is appropriate, in my opinion. We are fortunate that the electorate chose not to give her the power to prove the accuracy of the moniker, so far.
A nickname’s “snottiness” may be in the eye of the beholder: Take “Booger” Mcfarland for example... (All double entendres are the property of those with a sense of humor.)
Although it happens here, it is nothing compared to other"not so social" media. Most will say something inconsiderate in anger but usually apologize at some point.
I don't like it other places either, but over time, I have found it to be rampant here. Discussing issues, that is great, but once I see disparaging monikers, I know that I will rarely comment.
Not this discussion. It's been my experience that mods on other boards are a bit, say oppressive. In fact this is my first post. I intended to just "read the mail" for awhile, but there it is.
Well, it won't be me, and so far, no one else has. I only asked the question in the first place. This says to me that it could be possible to have a discussion without name calling or snotty nicknames. Whether it will ever happen or not...that remains to be seen.
Still thank you to everyone who weighed in with your opinion(s) on the query.
I just leave and don't come back, and I really felt that this was to be a great place to discuss issues. so while I may disagree, I am not going to express my opinion in such a way as to be rude.
It was when they first automated the process. It really wasn't a big deal and it did annoy me at the time but it worked out,
The Gulch has been a very good place to hash things out for quite some time. Most of the people I befriended here I still chat without outside the Gulch and I've even met a handful. Even so, my perspective tends to butt heads with some objectivist perspectives and things have gotten a bit heated but I think we all learned something.
The US is 320 million different people. A good portion of them are scary ignorant and hashing things out here (not clubbing them with ideology) can change peoples perspectives.
I respect Ayn Rand, she was a visionary but for me she was not 100% on target.
Sometimes a person needs to know how they are projecting themselves. Some people are so myopic and refuse to see that there is any other way of thinking that only a precise and accurate name is what penetrates the mental mutton. My opinion. We're all adults, no?
Adults? I can only see that in the context of pubescence. I could be mistaken. May have to consult the Scary Ignorant Mental Muttoned Slack Jaw Mouth Breather.
lol, being concise, not ranting, when unpacking the adjectives shows a degree of creativity. (and could be considered cathartic when dealing with some) :)
Interesting! I would contend that there is beauty in raw interpretation and association in any communication medium, if done well. A glass of Lambrusco helps take the edge off from time to time but it generally doesn't help when dealing with someone in real time. :)
AAHHHH!!!!! In highschool a friend of mine got tired of his young siblings, 7 year olds, drinking his specially blended juices. His father worked in anesthesia and mom as RN. He was already working in a hospital and had substantive background in chemistry and biology by then. He calculated the kids size and consumption and dosed his juice accordingly. Not nice yet affected their behavior.
Not nice at all...kind of like those people who mix ex-lax into a brownie mix knowing the person will eat more than he/she should and pay the consequences later.
Thank you for the post. Name calling is a byproduct of arrested development. The inability or lack of will to continue to question. Quest-I-On? or Quest-Shun? A choice.
Congregationalism is a concept of gathering where comfort is felt. Perhaps it is time to make a "push" on the comfort zones of the transgressors, I'll bet reasonable identification of the behavior results in angry insult.
It isn't so much that people here name call other users; it is more that people disparage political leaders, past and present, by coming up with a name that is making fun of the person.
I will be the first to admit that I don't like what some of Washington crowd does (their policies and philosophy), but I am not going to be rude about them.
Philosophical differences are one thing, but name calling, well...the point of the argument is lost when it becomes childish.
The unreconciled emotion that both Dagny Taggart and I have is that we are trying to preserve the great work we created so that we can provide well for ourselves while meeting and exceeding our paying customers' expectations at a time when the rest of the world is crumbling rather quickly all around us.
Defining the line when it is time to totally shrug is highly dependent on how invested you are in the current reality, especially when you love what you do.
I just closed 30 years of manufacturing business. I have moved from MN to eastern WI and have applied for 4 teaching positions in manufacturing tech. If accepted, will be income. Easy to make a living with my skill sets. Impetus for decision; to look after my folks and to teach. I'm currently, also, forming an authorship on the human condition. For a decade I have tried to punch holes in The Objectivist's Ethics. I have been putting the Declaration of Independence, The US Constitution and The Universal Declaration of Human Rights to test, against what I think is the most profound document in human history. Through this process I had to ask myself repeatedly about that which I had learned and the validity of the learning. I had to reflect on my bias through this learning; my percepts and precepts of what I am. I realize my bias may show in the metaphor of my language useage. I am changing my language, not to be placative; to be succinct. The most important discovery through this process has been the growing awareness of empathy I have. Discovering the more upset I became, the proportional care I had for the subject of discomfort. I made a profound choice. Not to enjoin in rhetoric; to seek solution at the most fundamental level. Not to use terminology of separatism; to use that of inclusivity. To understand that there are 7.5 billion personalities on this planet and that we share 3 common aspects; comfort / discomfort, happiness / unhappiness, equitable or inequitable interaction, Regarding this post, the use of derogatory, defaming language....is learned, somewhere, to be acceptable exchange. We are what we learn. If children were to use some of the epithets I have seen here......I'd wonder as to what kind of congregation / group they'd been exposed to or were growing up within that accepted those expressions. I'll never shrug from humanity. My Gulch is within me. From First Nation's Lakota: Mitakuye Oyasin! We are all related!
Your wishes well received. I have already won the game of life. I am happy and I know why. It is not a secret. It is learned. Less than two years ago I'd not had the tools of thought or expression I offer now. This is the culmination of more than forty years of not being satisfied with the status-quo explanations of life and relationships. I am soooooo lucky to have been exposed to Rand early. Anthem, Fountainhead and Atlas at age 15 to 16, yet these were not the most formative. Tao te Ching (The Way Of Life...according to Lao Tsu) Witter Bynner's translation and Rand's: "The Objectivist's Ethics" have been paramount for my development. Tao was at age 13 and Objectivist's Ethics only ten years past.
This forum is dense with those who have not arrested their development for the comfort of the congregation. We are in great company here.
Those we call out,..earned it and only have themselves to blame.
Would you still be respectful to someone that clearly does not respect you?
I'll agree, face to face...I'd love to say: "But I don't think of you, Mr Toohey."
Mankind's evolution into Conscious Introspection, something 60% of the population still has not achieved...including the majority of the "Ruleless" Delete class.
I guess what I am trying to say about name calling is this:
To me, if someone wishes to talk about a political leader, use their name as it is, not some made-up disparaging name. Why does it have to be insulting moniker? Am I making any sense here? Commander? edweaver? AJAshineoff? Abaco?
I, and many others here will not be drawn down into the emotional fray.....it's not reasonable. LOL
Why? You're fully entitled to the opinion you just gave.
Dinos just wanna have fun, yeah, dinos just wanna have fun.
Hey, hell's bell! where'd ah git thet thar from? Oh, yeah~~https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIb6A...
Hey, wait a dern minute! Ah ain't no dad-blamed girl.
I too chuckle at the creativity to bring some of these .....expressions....... to bear. I also laugh in relief at how ignorant I have been and that I have rectified ....most...of my behaviors. I am fallible, everything is learned. I am ignorant of many things. To take pride in ignorance is Stupid.
Abaco, I would like to chuckle about it, but it is no longer humorous to me. It seems like the rational mind we all claim to have is hijacked by the language spewed forth. Yet, everyone here within this thread has been polite and making sense. Further,everyone of you has managed to be civil throughout (thank you for that), but can it be sustained in all the forum threads?
It seems to me that as soon as separatist terms (as you called it Commander) are used, the rationality of the arguments go out the window. Moreover, it almost leaves no room for any kind of dissenting opinion as one would be called out (as Abaco was irrationally called stupid).
We all are fans of Ayn Rand and Atlas Shrugged or otherwise we wouldn't be here, so is it too much to ask for polite civility even if we don't particular care for any one politician/person?
Thank you all for weighing with rational thoughts.
Ellsworth Toohey doesn’t exactly evoke strength and decency, does it? But Howard Roark does. How about Cuffy Meigs? Wesley Mouch? Sound like mooch? How bout John Galt? That’s a tough guy.
As to name calling, sometimes you just have to call it like it is.
I wouldn’t call anyone on this site a name, but I sure love me some political name calling!
With that said, I totally agree with civil discourse between people having a conversation on various forums, including this one. There is no reason for the folks that come here to be mean to each other in that way. However, there have been many examples of humorous/affectionate name calling between participants here in the Gulch. We all "get it" and have a good time.
Fair enough. I asked the question so I accept your answers especially considering that it has been civil discourse.
Good topic.
Perhaps if people stopped calling looters names, they'd focus their anger in more productive ways, like some people did in 1776.
Still thank you to everyone who weighed in with your opinion(s) on the query.
Sorry but I still know that person is likely what I called him way back then.😆
And yes, sometimes you need to unpack your adjectives.
I just leave and don't come back, and I really felt that this was to be a great place to discuss issues.
so while I may disagree, I am not going to express my opinion in such a way as to be rude.
It really wasn't a big deal and it did annoy me at the time but it worked out,
The Gulch has been a very good place to hash things out for quite some time. Most of the people I befriended here I still chat without outside the Gulch and I've even met a handful. Even so, my perspective tends to butt heads with some objectivist perspectives and things have gotten a bit heated but I think we all learned something.
The US is 320 million different people. A good portion of them are scary ignorant and hashing things out here (not clubbing them with ideology) can change peoples perspectives.
I respect Ayn Rand, she was a visionary but for me she was not 100% on target.
I know you won't miss the context....
Name calling is a byproduct of arrested development. The inability or lack of will to continue to question. Quest-I-On? or Quest-Shun? A choice.
Congregationalism is a concept of gathering where comfort is felt. Perhaps it is time to make a "push" on the comfort zones of the transgressors, I'll bet reasonable identification of the behavior results in angry insult.
Your thoughts?
I will be the first to admit that I don't like what some of Washington crowd does (their policies and philosophy), but I am not going to be rude about them.
Philosophical differences are one thing, but name calling, well...the point of the argument is lost when it becomes childish.
Defining the line when it is time to totally shrug is highly dependent on how invested you are in the current reality, especially when you love what you do.
I have moved from MN to eastern WI and have applied for 4 teaching positions in manufacturing tech. If accepted, will be income. Easy to make a living with my skill sets.
Impetus for decision; to look after my folks and to teach.
I'm currently, also, forming an authorship on the human condition. For a decade I have tried to punch holes in The Objectivist's Ethics. I have been putting the Declaration of Independence, The US Constitution and The Universal Declaration of Human Rights to test, against what I think is the most profound document in human history. Through this process I had to ask myself repeatedly about that which I had learned and the validity of the learning. I had to reflect on my bias through this learning; my percepts and precepts of what I am. I realize my bias may show in the metaphor of my language useage. I am changing my language, not to be placative; to be succinct. The most important discovery through this process has been the growing awareness of empathy I have. Discovering the more upset I became, the proportional care I had for the subject of discomfort.
I made a profound choice. Not to enjoin in rhetoric; to seek solution at the most fundamental level. Not to use terminology of separatism; to use that of inclusivity. To understand that there are 7.5 billion personalities on this planet and that we share 3 common aspects; comfort / discomfort, happiness / unhappiness, equitable or inequitable interaction, Regarding this post, the use of derogatory, defaming language....is learned, somewhere, to be acceptable exchange. We are what we learn. If children were to use some of the epithets I have seen here......I'd wonder as to what kind of congregation / group they'd been exposed to or were growing up within that accepted those expressions.
I'll never shrug from humanity. My Gulch is within me. From First Nation's Lakota: Mitakuye Oyasin! We are all related!
This forum is dense with those who have not arrested their development for the comfort of the congregation. We are in great company here.