Atlantis Locales
jbrenner made a suggestion of possibly an island near Australia. I looked at a couple of other locales for a few more choices. Here they are:
1
Posted by $ johnrobert2 19 minutes ago
Tahiti group. Nice size, price unknown at this time. Looks pretty nice and completely undeveloped. Only drawback is leasehold status. Wonder if freehold could be negotiated?
Read more at http://www.galtsgulchonline.com/posts/e8...
1
Posted by $ johnrobert2 24 minutes ago
Here's an Aussie one. Couldn't find too many pix but looks interesting and the price is not forbidding.
Read more at http://www.galtsgulchonline.com/posts/e8...
1
Posted by $ johnrobert2 28 minutes ago
Another in the Fiji group. A hundred times smaller and costing a fourth of the first one. Less b4tb IMO
Read more at http://www.galtsgulchonline.com/posts/e8...
1
Posted by $ johnrobert2 45 minutes ago
Here is one in the Fiji group. A bit high but, Holy Crap!!, 10,000 acres. Lots of room for development. Some spectacular photos in this one.
Read more at http://www.galtsgulchonline.com/posts/e8...
1
Posted by $ johnrobert2 19 minutes ago
Tahiti group. Nice size, price unknown at this time. Looks pretty nice and completely undeveloped. Only drawback is leasehold status. Wonder if freehold could be negotiated?
Read more at http://www.galtsgulchonline.com/posts/e8...
1
Posted by $ johnrobert2 24 minutes ago
Here's an Aussie one. Couldn't find too many pix but looks interesting and the price is not forbidding.
Read more at http://www.galtsgulchonline.com/posts/e8...
1
Posted by $ johnrobert2 28 minutes ago
Another in the Fiji group. A hundred times smaller and costing a fourth of the first one. Less b4tb IMO
Read more at http://www.galtsgulchonline.com/posts/e8...
1
Posted by $ johnrobert2 45 minutes ago
Here is one in the Fiji group. A bit high but, Holy Crap!!, 10,000 acres. Lots of room for development. Some spectacular photos in this one.
Read more at http://www.galtsgulchonline.com/posts/e8...
One - people need to define exactly what one is "going galt" from, and why. It seems that people are all about living a less-restricted, freer life - then willing to look at places that are more restrictive than the US Mainland.
I think we need to decide exactly how restricted we wish to be - no guns, criminal penalties for speaking out against the government,
I keep seeing people mention this country or that - without realizing people are going Galt FROM those countries to here, because of the restrictions those countries place on them, or the absolute socialist nature of their dotgovs, or their tanking economy, or the rising tide of islamofascism at their door or the threat of conflict on their shores.
Are you really serious? Fiji? Australia? Tahiti? Are we looking at a timeshare, or a viable place to live?
Just saying... I'm reading a lot of pie in the sky, but not really hep on plunking down residency somewhere that would get me a lengthy prison sentence in a rathole and then deported (with my name on the "potential enemy combatant" list for leaving) for writing whats on my mind like we all do here.
Maybe I'm wrong... maybe I am mising the rosy pie in the sky, no one will look at us illusion and want to cash in everything to move to New Zealand (who would then not want me because I don't have the requisite deposit to insure I'm not a drain on society)...
Two - I also see something else here that is disturbing - the question keeps coming up "Who is Midas Mulligan"... which should be taken as a warning. A serious warning. IF we're unable to even finance the initial buy-in, and have the requisite capital to make this "start up business" work, what makes one think this venture would even survive the first year? I remember those 60's communes (I am that old) and they failed for much the same reasons I can see the Gulch tanking. Most everyone here has Champagne dreams and Caviar visions but has a Budweiser Budget, and even less resources. Who here owns a vehicle company? A Steel mill? A bank? Hell, I have a small business and can't give up my day job to make ends meet. What when you have a 10K a day ship to run to get stuff to you - NOT counting purchasing said stuff? Not counting building a power plant (no free power in this gulch) and having fresh water and 2 years to get food growing (ever do any food raising? Remember – it’s not up to “someone else” it’s all on YOUR shoulders, and a lot of people don’t realize that chickens don’t come from the Styrofoam and plastic wrap plant… And that someone has to raise, tend to, and plant that food – and take the hit when crops go bad, as they sometimes do.
Sorry, but I need a reality check. Got half a million as a BUY IN and then do you have the other 2.5 Mil to build something and have a way to get food and water and power there? Hell, I cash EVERYTHING in I can barely make the quarter million someone else said here, then I'm done - flat broke bankrupt and BETTER have a welfare nanny state (or a rich daddy Midas) to take care of me. Eh? Can you pull capital out of the air? Can you produce from Nothing? I sure as hell can’t…
To me, being a Producer means being able to make my own decisions and live somewhat independent of restrictions and regulations, to have a comfortable life and to not live hand to mouth and rely on someone else to make my way in life. That’s how I live now. Do I really want to trade that in for a timeshare that will put me and my family in the position of NEEDING to be a moocher because I sunk everything into the Gulch and have nothing left?
from the Caribbean - Tahiti, Haiti, and Trinidad - and left over severe repression.
I do have dreams and plans to see them to fruition, but I also will not go into bankruptcy for something that if I cannot afford I would do to be part of a crowd. It is a failing of mine, but at 6 decades I realize that I sometimes have to stand alone and speak my mind rather than be a sheep. I was a follower when I was a slimeball commie wannabee, and I regret that to this day I fell so low and sold out those I love...
Hope you understand!
S
People thought I must be off my rocker. I was warned of wildfires, bears and other wild animals, raving bands of rednecks, meth heads, religious fanatics, and cartel pot growers. I was giving up a sure thing and chance for advancement to do a minor job someplace where no one wanted to go... and of course, how would I survive up there, miles from the city and "civilization"... and starting my own business? Tales of gloom and doom and bankruptcy and no way I would make it work away from my "friends". One even had the audacity to declare that I must have taken some "bad acid"...
Oooh yeah. That boxcar of ones fate has strange callings, but would I rather be where I was? Slaving for the good of others, draining my talent and my soul into the abyss of associates who not only didn't give a whit about me and mine, but about themselves as well...
Yeah. I could have "all that" and end up a hollow shell. Or I could live for me, and my dreams, not their wants. So in a real way I relate to the uncle and his boxcar... he found his truth. And he found HIS Gulch.
If someone wants to start a commune or country club, fine...but, I don't see that as having anything to do with "Gulch" values.
What we may need to be doing is figuring out what legal code we will abide and how best to implement it. Then, locations become more flexible. For any of us to invest assets, we would need to know the structure that protects our rights.
There *are* a couple I have considered as well, but there are language barriers, and of course, you would still fall under that country's legal code, which to some could be pretty onerous.
Besides - if everyone sinks everything into some relocation overseas... who's gonna stay here and fix the disaster we have right here at home... or afford to come back once we're at that point? (Darned if that doesn't sound like Scab Dagny, thinking about it...)
However, I do understand what you meant. The free market attitude that is still inside many people in the US (ignoring the bankster elite) is not ingrained in Aussies or Kiwis. The propaganda from the US looks so good, but the reality is not (any longer.) When the US dollar loses its world currency staus, there will be a lot of Aussies returning down under and a lot of US citizens will wish they could, too.
I admit to being biased in favor of Oz (and to a lesser extent NZ.) Unlike their US cousins, the Aussie politicians haven't had a chance to piss me off completely yet. ;^) I suspect that regardless of where I go, the politicians and bureaucrats will be unsatisfactory.
Significant advantages: English speaking, great climate, low population density, rich natural resources, good natural border defence, history of law and order, common ancestry and similar culture, self reliant in food production, managable debt.
I am SO glad my folks didn't emigrate there when I was younger. Kicks down under right off my map. Only thing they need to add now is "People's republic of..." before the name.
What is fascinating to me is, that with a few exceptions, I watch our freedoms being eroded, and its like the rest of the world has to play catch-up and erode THEIR people's rights even further.
I'm closely watching Italy... if they go the way of Terra Australius Incomprehensabilis, I know a chunk of property there that will be going on the blocks. So far it's not... fingers definitely crossed there.
One of the advantages of Rand's Gulch was its proximity to the civilization that it was striking against.
This is so much bigger than currency issues. right now the USD is the reserve currency. It won't be forever. This does not matter, except in trivial ways like making it harder for US to borrow, which is actually a good thing. UK used to be a major empire. Now it's not, and it doesn't matter all that much.
The Gulch isn't a place of last resort. It's a place for people who see the amazing future ahead and want to play a role in it in a place where they're free to move fast and break things. Maybe (highly unlikely) they'll form a federation of colonies and form something new an amazing like the US Founders did. Maybe it will be something like a state but a non-state; something no one seriously thought of seriously realizing outside of ancient Greek theorists. In such a narrative, the US carries on as the UK did. The usual ups and downs of life and history carry on. Many places might model their Constitutions after the non-state that emerges in Atlantis. The Founders were part of something amazing.
I'm **not** predicting this outcome, but some little sliver of it would be amazing... even a tiny sliver like a retirement home for intellectuals and incubator that gives birth to something like Twitter would be very cool.
It's not a place of last resort. It's a place helping pull humankind into the future.
Exactly. I'm saying it takes more than that. It takes something positive happening in the enclave, not just dissatisfaction with one's own country.
"Many will have family ties that keep them here. That is why the Rearden family component to AS was SO critical."
If I had some of Rearden's family, that would be a family tie driving me to leave for some remote island. :)
His wife kept saying all business is dirty business, which is part of dirty politics. She's a nasty villain, a master of politics. She's one step up from the sanctimonious little shrew who dolled out alms in the motor plant.
Quite a few of my past students are Argentine, and I like their people. Their currency, on the other hand, scares me more than the US's currency. It would take a currency collapse for me to leave the US. I am not going somewhere that the currency is substantially less reliable. In the interim, Khalling's plan of exploring multiple options over the next few years while we formulate requirements and evaluate options is a sound one.
Hiding in plain sight would be my preferred option, but I would prefer to do that in the states, where the terrain is more familiar as it were.
I think subconsciously a lot of people might be equating "hiding in plain sight" to "sheltering in place" meaning not doing anything.
A remote location does have its appeal.
I'll lend a hand where I can with any option.
As for myself, once I am gone, I am gone. Don't plan to come back unless things are vastly different here.
The shock to come from changing that, there is no logical method to factor for.
You have to make your best guess and either shrug....or not.
There are many reasons to not shrug, but ultimately we have to make the decision. And indecision turns into not in the end.
I think many of us take for granted many of the conveniences that living in the US provides (as a result of the productivity of many.)
If the gulch doesn't provide most of those conveniences we may not get long term gulchers that would be a real benefit to the community.
I have learned over the past few years traveling overseas that many of the trappings of USA consumerism that have been purchased by multitudes are not required for my happiness, but modern sanitation, transportation, and indoor climate control (et al) are extremely desirable.
1750 acres, price negotiable.
http://www.nzfarms.co.nz/2290443
North Island location, decent climate.
In latin/central/south america and asia this 'process' usually includes relatively direct bribes. In western countries the bribery component is less obvious, and often more insidious and more expensive.
(Not to sound too negative, I hope.)
I agree. I say pretend like there's nothing going on. I'm not saying to lie just to stay under the radar. When the next Facebook founded their goes public, let politicians in the host country take credit for all the "jobs the politicians created" (bite your tongue hard to avoid speaking) on a little island. Just as in the US half of them will scream at the other half that the politician was friggin' amazing or is about to destroy the entire world. The Gulch carries on and ignores it.
In the US you have to be a millionaire at least to participate in the system of favortism. In Panama, almost anyone can afford it. It's "equal opportunity corruption."
Unfortunately, I think that expat is now serving 20 years in federal prison, after being kidnapped by thugs (possibly Panama government authorized thugs) that were likely financally encouraged to 'extradite' the expat ignoring Panamanian legal process.
Staying below the radar is vital, and as in AS looters rarely stay bought.
~6000 acres asking $2.2 million
http://www.vladi-private-islands.de/en/i...
map (approx location):
https://maps.google.com.au/maps?client=o...
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Helvec...
Not much telling which one is it but none look promising.
I think this is closer to the location (5 min by boat from Saladero Cabal which is the point on this map.
https://maps.google.com.au/maps?client=o...
2470 acres asking $10 million
http://www.vladi-private-islands.de/en/i...
http://islasanpedro.net/
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Isla+S...
The river mouth may be too shallow to permit large vessel operation. And there seems to be no appreciable reason to build one as there is negligible population.
Cape Campbell, Marlborough
3316 acres asking 10 million NZD
(US$8.5 million)
http://www.vladi-private-islands.de/en/b...
http://www.immigration.govt.nz/migrant/s...
The "invest" immigration category is likely more appropriate for Gulchers:
http://www.immigration.govt.nz/migrant/s...
NZ does have a national health law and therefore they are less open to retirees who are not contributing to NZ and can not provide for themselves in the event of illness.
http://www.privateislandsonline.com/isla...
http://www.privateislandsonline.com/isla...
Business friendly.
The youngest (volcanic) mountain in the chain. How active is the volcano?
Looking at the periodic table, aluminium is in the same column as boron; which has been suggested as deficiency aids in arthritis pain.
I thought that plaques in the brains of Alzheimer's patients contain aluminium.
Any comments?
Have you heard anything about mineral deficiency diseases? And how simple diet changes could reduce severity or their incidence altogether?
I am concerned with the use of aluminium flocculation as a part of water treatment making a overabundance of aluminum a problem that the body has trouble eliminating.
Do you mean a particular property or the entire notion? Is the notion a thought experiment, or might you execute.
I love the notion. I'm on the fence about getting involved. If I ever get a system working where I can handle projects without my personal involvement in all details, I might put time into a Gulch effort.
I want it to be close to the US, have a resort component, be encouraging of trade, and be focused on attracting businesses.
I'm a strong supporter of the idea. I would set up surveys, find out how to set up a 501c3 or whatever structure, but it's very very limited unfortunately. I'm willing to goof off less on this site to do some actual work on this project though.
http://www.privateislandsonline.com/isla...
That's the size of a city. I like the cost per acre but I still wish it were closer to US so I could visit more easily.
Vanua Levu, Fiji
I think we're approaching an onrush of amazing accomplishments, changes as big as the industrial revolution. The resulting wealth will hopefully propel people to new places, Gulches of sorts, where new ideas will come from new situations. My kids get a lecture when they complain about not having a certain video they want available on-demand on a phone. Their kids will have things way more amazing.
This is the watershed time when everyone started carrying a phone camera. Maybe in a few hundred years there'll be a turning point when aging is drastically reduced or cured, and changes of a plummeting death rate and birth rate ripple through the world.
So I want a Gulch for a different reason. I'm willing to put some very limited time and effort into it if I can help.
Am I talking out of turn, jb?
Suggestions from me are a dime a dozen. Executing anything at all is harder.
If you do it near Florida or near WI and it has a hotel component, I will devote real effort to it.
The reason for the qualified support is it's so easy to say, "Oh yeah, count me in. I wanna help." But serving on any board takes real time, and that time competes with clients. It's easy to leave volunteer board/committee work hanging when a crisis on a paid project occurs. I never say yes unless I put the time on my calendar. If I volunteered on this, it would come out of my goofing-off-on-the-Gulch-website time.
http://www.privateislandsonline.com/isla...
http://www.geodata.us/australia_names_ma...
imo, Central Queensland is probably the most civilized and friendly place you could find, but immigration is difficult for over 50 unless wealthy, or with significant pension, or with guaranteed salary. Also it's almost firearm free.
http://www.privateislandsonline.com/isla...
600 acres on an island 1 km from the main Fijian island. Price unknown for now.
Approximately 1 km off the Northern Coast of Viti Levu Fiji, Nananu-i-cake presents a very rare opportunity to purchase an exclusive freehold private island, with all facilities in place for immediate occupation. The property is an easy-to-manage turn-key operation with excellent infrastructure in place.
Accommodations on the island include a 4 bedroom main house, 2 traditional Fiji guest Bures, and three staff houses. The main residence is complete with a large open plan living/dining room, library, barbecue/dining bure, and laundry facilities. These arrangements allow for 6 bedroom suites.
Other amenities featured on the island consist in a swimming pool, 5 beaches, phone, internet, satellite, generators and TV connection, stables, a large deep water jetty, two 150,000 gallon water tanks filled from a natural water source, boats, jeeps, a tractor, other transport vehicles, tools and maintenance equipment.
The area is developed with well defined road/trails for vehicles and horse trekking. Paddocks for horses and sheep are also available.
Island management/maintenance staff are currently in place, and may be available to transfer with the property, if required.
Renovations include: a re-roofing of the main house complex with bitumen tiles, recent refurnishing of the bathrooms, and an upgrading of the swimming pool.
The property is decorated with extensively landscaped gardens that have been developed over a generation. Most of the island, however, still maintains its natural tropical vegetation, including groves of mango trees lining some of the trails, and pine forests for potential harvest.
There is extensive potential for further development. .
One can access the island by a leisurely drive of around 2 and a half hours from Nadi International Airport, or a drive of under 3 hours from Suva. It looks like the drive is only about 70 miles. I could drive my golf cart to the airport in that time. Speaking of which, a fleet of golf carts might be appropriate Atlantis transportation.
This is one worth looking at. Probably my favorite so far, because of its base of operation.
https://www.google.com/maps/search/Nanan...