How will medical issues be dealt with in a real-life Gulch?
subtitle: an offshoot of "What will you sacrifice....
This thread assumes that we are talking about one of the various types of real-life Gulches, not a virtual one. I'm not looking for conversation about "what kind of Gulch will we have?" - that is dealt with elsewhere.
I am re-posting my comments on the subject, with additions, originally from "...sacrifice..."
This thread assumes that we are talking about one of the various types of real-life Gulches, not a virtual one. I'm not looking for conversation about "what kind of Gulch will we have?" - that is dealt with elsewhere.
I am re-posting my comments on the subject, with additions, originally from "...sacrifice..."
Previous comments...
Much appreciated
Lise (Looking forward to connecting to fellow objectivists, it can be lonely out there, especially in Australia)
Our children and their children are young and strong and could likely withstand years of sub-optimal care, while they wait for their fledgling medical services to develop in the Gulch. Consider, for instance, the risks that the two dozen or so that are talking about shipping off to Mars will be taking, by leaving major medical centers behind in their wake. Yet, I believe that most of them fully expect to live long, healthy lives.
No, I don't know if I or my wife would survive in a "primitive" Galt's Gulch, but I believe that such a place will be more for the productive young than for those of us who merely wish to relax in our golden years.
In a small valley that isn't magically provisioned with resources that are sparsely distributed around the world, there are many things that simply wouldn't be available. In high altitude Colorado mountain valleys, you can't even grow tobacco in the "real world", never mind the health problems it causes. But you could have a green house, if you figured out a way to make the glass.
Neither could you have the resources or chemical plant equipment for making something as simple as aspirin. Making aspirin first requires the Kolbe-Schmitt process to make salicylic acid with phenol, sodium hydroxide, CO2, and an acidifying agent. The resulting salicylic acid must be crystallized from aqueous solution to give a technical grade 99.5% essential component for aspirin. Then the salicylic acid must be reacted with a liquor of acetic anhydride and toluene at a controlled temperature for 20 hours, followed by cooling for 3-4 days, precipitated into crystals and purified as aspirin. But then you would have to make or acquire all of these raw starting chemicals including phenol, sodium hydroxide, acetic anhydride and toluene.
So what percentage of the scarce Objectivist productive resources of Galt's Gulch would it take simply to make aspirin? Certain things require a minimum critical mass to get the required economies of scale to make them feasible to do. Galt's Gulch would not be a utopia by any means.
Very interesting. I haven't read the book in a long time, but I don't see how the Gulch could be completely self sufficient without living in a more primitive state, which would preclude the occupations of many of the residents. Is there a pertinent passage in the book that I do not recall? Anyone? Obviously many of the durable products in the Gulch had origins outside. I suspect that the Gulch would have to deal with the outside world... certain more favorable countries or underground traders, willing to accept gold or other commodities in trade. Black market if necessary... Hmmm....?
Regards,
O.A.
Yes. However, is it possible that the entire world was not the "looter's world"? A generality perhaps? There would, of necessity, have to be some outsiders still willing to trade value for value. The Gulch had planes, automobiles, trucks, refrigerators etc.... they could transport goods, but would require repairs and parts. As you have indicated the Valley could not have provided the myriad of raw materials. It couldn't provide all of the specialized skills, equipment and heavy industry necessary for self sufficiency on the level of which they were accustomed. It would not be possible to produce the durable goods or replacement parts for everything without bringing a substantial number of supplies and people in up front, or having some connections outside. Consider the wide array of materials and skills required to build an air conditioner or an automobile and other products. Almost every existing industry would have to be represented, even if on a smaller scale. This does not seem plausible in one valley. Some goods would need to be obtained outside, or the valley would have to be immense and filled with sufficient sources of every element. Today's even more technological age and wider array of skills, division of labor, etc. would make the logistics even more difficult.
Perhaps Ragnar could continue pirating or trading as required on his outside adventures. Otherwise the Gulch might be very short lived indeed. One generation of retired producers would be replaced in a generation. Perhaps that is all that is needed to bring the world to its senses.
Certainly, it is true that the premise was that the world could not maintain its infrastructure or economy, let alone grow it without the innovators and prime producers. And, the producers were better equipped to thrive independently than the looters... In our world, perhaps it is a matter of degrees. Whether it is an overt organizing of a strike or a disorganized happenstance that producers are simply not producing to their ability due to a sense of futility and unfairness (something happening today) the Thompsons of the world would be in an increasingly tough spot.
In AS it is after all a bit of fiction, a device, but it is also a powerful idea despite its implementation problems. Even if only short term it came to pass, the looters and moochers would be forced to face their inadequacy and need for producers. Collapse would be inevitable. That could be opportunity and impetus enough for a new beginning.
This thread's subject was healthcare and while doctors may not be a problem, like other things, medicines are obtained and manufactured from materials spread around the globe...
Just some thoughts... excellent ruminating. :)
Regards,
O.A.
From Temlakos:
“The main idea of the Gulch is a community in isolation. When Dagny crashed into it, it was already self-sufficient, except for a few supplies for which Midas Mulligan had a "pipeline" from the outside. Let's not kid ourselves. That pipeline was Ragnar Danneskjöld. It was some of his prize cargoes that he couldn't necessarily sell in Europe. Ragnar explained to Hank Rearden he had "customers" in the USA territory. Correction: one customer. Midas Mulligan. “ http://www.galtsgulchonline.com/posts/24...
One of the Gulchers is a fairly young female doctor, but I forgot her name.
I plan on bringing a very large supply of medications for my personal use. As for pharmaceuticals production, I could do that, but probably won't. I certainly can put together the process flowsheet for making such pharmaceuticals quite quickly.
Cranio
Rectal
Inversion
Syndrome
thank you so very much!
I suspect that it is related to assifasis [the spelling changes] - where what comes out of thee face is what should be coming out of the...you get my drift.
Why was the one in Chile a fraud?
Lise
An 'island of liberty' inside a US dictatorship can be easily crushed by embargo.