Poll: Do you think Trump has done something for which he should be imprisioned?
Posted by craigerb 2 years, 3 months ago to Government
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understand it.
Like all super successful business men, there is always women around...the culture during those days got to us all...including what it takes to do business in that culture.
One should note, in one's younger days it is difficult to control the temptations of the brain but most of us, eventually win that war with an ever improving strong mind.
By the time we reach our 40s,50s,60s plus, it's not much of an issue.
That's life in this cycle of civilization. Let's just hope the next cycle will produce better and better Humans as we evolve.
We are living in the notes of a book unwritten...the words in the song of the fat lady will signal: The End.
Wow, where is this coming from?
Btw - I didn't downvote you. Yet. That being said, if you can't rebut my argument, I expect you to admit the point. We engage in actual thought and debate on this forum, not the meaningless partisan drivel on many other sites. Come armed with a solid argument and backup or have the integrity to admit your ignorance. I have done so on more than one occasion. The people on this board are intelligent and thoughtful. Disrespect them at your own peril.
but I have seen the JustUS Dept., the FBI, and others presenting manufactured false
'evidence' against Trump.
The government has proven their own guilt and their own trustworthiness.
They are guilty of treason and acted in a coup d etat.
Every action taken by the current administration and con-gress is null and void.
craigerb, you asked for opinions, but you neglected to post your own.
Please post your answer.
I’ve seen NO QUALIFIED EVIDENCE that implicates him.
How do I know that statement is true? Because if there was ANY after the Mueller Investigation, Impeachment #1, Impeachment #2, 6 years worth of vitriol and the FBI RAID........they’d have him in custody by now.
For those of you that think so...please cite statute that he violated and present evidence of such.
PS we value objectivism here so your feelings are disqualified as evidence.
18 U.S.C. 1924 Unauthorized removal and retention of classified documents or material
(a) Whoever, being an officer, employee, contractor, or consultant of the United States, and, by virtue of his office, employment, position, or contract, becomes possessed of documents or materials containing classified information of the United States, knowingly removes such documents or materials without authority and with the intent to retain such documents or materials at an unauthorized location shall be fined under this title or imprisoned for not more than five years, or both.
(b) For purposes of this section, the provision of documents and materials to the Congress shall not constitute an offense under subsection (a).
(c) In this section, the term “classified information of the United States” means information originated, owned, or possessed by the United States Government concerning the national defense or foreign relations of the United States that has been determined pursuant to law or Executive order to require protection against unauthorized disclosure in the interests of national security.
Penalty increased under President Trump
Pub. L. 115–118 SEC. 202. INCREASED PENALTY FOR UNAUTHORIZED REMOVAL AND
RETENTION OF CLASSIFIED DOCUMENTS OR MATERIAL.
Section 1924(a) of title 18, United States Code, is amended
by striking ‘‘one year’’ and inserting ‘‘five years’’.
Other mitigating factors involved include:
1. Conflict of interest from the sitting Attorney General. Remember, this was the man whose nomination for SCOTUS was pulled after Trump won office. To say Garland has a bone to pick with Trump is an understatement. Garland admitted yesterday that he personally authorized the raid on Trump's Mar A Lago residence.
2. Conflict of interest from the judge approving the warrant. This guy is known to have defended clients of the Lolita Express, aka Jeffrey Epstein's pedophilia ring. Also of note is that he is a provisional judge serving part of an eight-year term, not your typical Federal judge with a lifetime appointment. The judge also openly posted criticism of Trump on her personal Facebook page.
3. Trump had already complied with the National Archives' request to secure the documents in question, among which are personal memos from foreign leaders and memorabilia from his time in office which are his by right and law.
4. The agents executing the warrant denied Trump's lawyers the right to oversee the seizure. This is a gross violation because the oversight is there to verify the contents weren't tampered with during the process. Any objective judge could easily invalidate all the evidence gained on this one item alone (assuming that there are discrepancies).
5. The nature of the raid itself. Why send in 30 officers when all it took was a simple request to see the items in question? Because this wasn't about compliance, but about planting evidence and intimidation.
6. The FBI admits waiting until Trump was away from the residence to conduct the raid. Why? If the material is that damning, you wouldn't care if he were there or not.
Why did Trump authorize the increased penalties? See Sandy Berger - the Clinton aide who was convicted of removing and destroying unique documents from the National Archives. Which leads us to...
7. Why such disparate treatment of Hillary Clinton, who is KNOWN to have been compromised and was illegally and knowingly peddling classified documents in full violation of the statute posted above? Why was Hillary Clinton deposed in front of one of her own attorneys - another witness? Why were several of Hillary's aides granted complete immunity even before their testimony had been heard? Why did the FBI telegraph their intentions and then wait two weeks to confiscate the devices in question - only to receive 1/10th of the devices in question and none of them in functioning condition? Why was Hillary Clinton not jailed for tampering with and destruction of evidence?
He has verified this.
The way I see it 15 boxes of evidence that will now be introduced into the court.
Let’s see if any evidence of sedition or treason is included.
IMHO, the next round of fake accusations has just begun with this latest FBI "raid".
Why would he receive a prison sentence if Nixon, didn’t?
Let me tell you what would happen if the Left sentences him to prison, never mind, I don’t think it takes much imagination.
Three words - Tiered justice system
- Obama fast and furious – or - Guns for the other team.
- Obama Iran payoff – or – midnight cash flight
- Targeted IRS prosecution of conservatives – or – punish and shutdown potential rivals
- Destruction of evidence – or – personal e-mail server (who does that?)
- e-mail Server boy walks - or - Giving a pardon to a witness to a crime must be a crime, obstruction?
- Obama release Gitmo detainees – or – free range hunting
- Benghazi – or – the precursor to Afghanistan
- DNC operative, Seth Rich, dead – or – Hillary killed him
- Falsifying evidence and obtaining search warrants on false pretenses – or – The wiretap – or – pee party
- CIA running a program to compromise the influential – or – Epstein Island
- Epstein’s death – or – Hillary killed him
- Obstructing Justice – or – The tarmac meeting
- Promoting violent riots across America – or – This isn’t your typical J6 style peaceful protest
- Aiding and abetting the criminal – or – delivering pallets of bricks to a riot
- The Clinton Foundation – or - Running a non-profit like a laundromat
- I’m running out of energy to keep writing these down, the Biden Epic begins…
- Ukraine biolabs – or – why? WTF, we said so, why? WTF
- Ukraine business deals – or – Just like the client foundation, only bigger and better.
- Afghanistan withdraws – or – Cash, arms, facilities, from America as a gift. I think directed by the CCP
- Illegal Search and seizure – or – The Mar-a-Lago straw
This just off of the top of my head, I'm sure there is more... A lot more...
Yes a long list. According to the latest Justice Department figures, more than 855 members of that crowd are facing charges that range from trespassing on restricted grounds to seditious conspiracy. Prosecutors estimate that more than 2,000 people actually entered the Capitol unlawfully that day, which means hundreds more arrests are likely in the months to come.
Your sought-after prosecutions will follow.
Re: Jan 6 th please explain the lack of interest in Ray Epps.
You are an embarrassment to this group. AND Ayn Rand. AND, BTW, you are muted, so I won't see any more of your ridiculous drivel.
Crybaby.
Of course you were responding to what I said and you were wrong. The shame is on you.
This may help from Blarmans post
“And let's not forget the pictures of FBI officers in civilian clothes such as Ray Epps who are filmed actively agitating the crowd. And yet - unsurprisingly - there has been no mention of the prosecution of Ray Epps for inciting a riot!”
Ray Epps the night before was videoed telling people to storm the Capital , same thing at the Capital on the 6th.
"denying any and all allegations".
Also innocent before the law is not the same as innocent in fact.
Check your premises.
All because of people like you who will take any "fact," no matter how fanciful, and run with it.
And since when did YOU become arbiter of "innocent in fact?"
There is also the serious problem of the 13,000+ hours of videotape that the DC Metro and Capitol police refuse to give over to defense attorneys. The little we have seen - most of it from personal cell phones - shows a complicit police force actually waving people into the building! (Some of them - to their credit - intervened to prevent some older members of the crowd swept up in the push from being trampled.)
Another thing to point out is that - contrary to the right to a speedy trial and contrary to the law - many of those arrested were held in solitary confinement in DC jails for months on end - some for more than a year. It was a legal travesty that the judge involved didn't at least acknowledge this illegal treatment. (The DC jails also on several occasions prevented Congressional Representatives Matt Gaetz and Marjorie Taylor-Greene from visiting the interees.)
And let's not forget the pictures of FBI officers in civilian clothes such as Ray Epps who are filmed actively agitating the crowd. And yet - unsurprisingly - there has been no mention of the prosecution of Ray Epps for inciting a riot!
Last thing to remember, President Trump petitioned Congress to station 20,000 National Guard troops around the Capitol on that day. That request was denied by none other than Nancy Pelosi.
Here's an alternative prediction: A Republican (Trump, DeSantis, Cruz, etc.) will win office in 2024 and immediately pardon everyone "convicted" in these sham courts.
There is plenty of such confirmation.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/pence-se...
Well played Deep State! Well played.
We may all pity the people in Cuba, North Korea, China, Venezuela. But, at LEAST they know who’s ACTUALLY calling the shots in their governments.
Marinate on that for a bit before returning to our normally scheduled programming.
he tried to fight the Deep State
and was betrayed
just as We the People have been betrayed for years
Why would the Russians want Trump in the White House rather than Hillary Clinton? Isn't it obvious that her political attitudes are more in accord with those of the Russians than Trumps'
are?!
Yes, her domestic policy is closer to Russia's than Trumps is. But Russia is more concerned with U,S. foreign policy. Clinton favored a strong NATO, while Trump tried to undermine it. Also Trump could be manipulated by the promise of a hotel in Moscow.
I give 👍 for all those I agree with.
also would be helpful it a reason was given
There is nothing I can say that will convince anyone who is a Trump fan that he has done anything wrong, let alone that he has done anything criminal, so why bother?
Please tell me what criminal acts Trump has committed?
List them please, I will wait…
I have presented facts on here before and been accused of spouting propaganda, but here we go again--
Fact: he, as a private citizen, removed classified documents from the White House to his personal residence.
Fact: that is against federal law.
Fact: he himself increased the penalty for a violation of that particular law from one year to five years while he was President.
So, fact: he was aware of the law and the penalty for violating it and proceeded anyway.
1) These documents, ie the documents raided by the FBI, were removed from the White House BEFORE he left office. The National Archives confirmed this and have been "negotiating" with the former President since he left office. Many of the items and documents are personal memos and memorabilia from his time in office. This is not abnormal and not in the slightest bit irregular. Presidents for more than 50 years have kept such to be turned over to their respective Presidential libraries. The National Archives maintains awareness of them in case the items do not eventually end up in such libraries. That's why they asked President Trump to secure them (the padlock broken by the FBI search team).
2) The President of the United States has full authority to declassify any document he/she chooses. This power is unique to the President of the United States. As several former Federal Prosecutors have pointed out: good luck prosecuting a former President of the United States for having classified documents.
I would strongly encourage you not to jump to hasty conclusions, else you become like so many of "our liberal friends. They know so many things that just aren't so." - Ronald Reagan
Are you sure? {See The Atomic Energy Acts of 1946 and 1954.)
You'll also note the dramatic backpedaling of the National Archives regarding the >30 MILLION documents Obama took when he left office. Trumps 20 boxes (if you accept the FBI's count) amounts to only a few dozen in comparison.
Not that I doubt your assurances, but how do you reconcile them with this:
"On August 1, 1946, President Truman signed the Atomic Energy Act of 1946 which established the category of classified information known as "Restricted Data" (RD). This Act gave the Atomic Energy Commission (now the Department of Energy (DOE)) unilateral authority over this information."
.https://sgp.fas.org/othergov/doe/rdfrdhtm.html
Protecting the Nation's Nuclear Information
https://sgp.fas.org › othergov › doe › rdfrdhtm
On August 1, 1946, President Truman signed the Atomic Energy Act of 1946 which established the category of classified information known as "Restricted Data" (RD). This Act gave the Atomic Energy Commission (now the Department of Energy (DOE)) unilateral authority over this information.
Protecting the Nation's Nuclear Information
https://sgp.fas.org › othergov › doe › rdfrdhtm
“as a private citizen” – how is this known? Seems like this would have been done when he was present.
“removed classified documents” – how do you know he didn’t declassify them?
“from the White House” – How do you know these were originally in the white house? Just saying this might be important in court.
How is this different than any other president that has left office?
“against federal law” – what is against federal law, exactly what statute did he violate? I want specifics as you seem so knowledgeable.
“he himself increased the penalty for a violation of that particular law from one year to five years while he was President” – Okay, but I don’t see how this makes him guilty?
“So, fact: he was aware of the law and the penalty for violating it and proceeded anyway” – That seems like a leap, a big leap.
You see, Hilary Clinton had tons of classified e-mails on her server that were deleted and never investigated. Obviously, she wasn’t prosecuted because she didn’t intend to store these thousands of e-mails on her private e-mails server away from normal audit and review process.
I don’t usually like to troll but when I do, I love Trolling a troll.
18 U.S.C. §§ 793, 2071, or 1519, including the following."
18 USC 793 — Gathering, transmitting or losing defense information
18 USC 2071 — Concealment, removal or mutilation
18 USC 1519 — Destruction, alteration or falsification of records in Federal investigations
My problem is that you were stating guilt before you knew the crime. Now we have a list of offences, we can ask for the specific around each of these are why the government thinks he committed a crim. One step at a time...
Here's why to bother:
“The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men should do nothing.”
We should not give this forum over to anti-American
pro-Russian trolls.
Me dino not know why. You're supposed to say "Asian" instead. Stupid.
By the way, I saw a movie called "The Orient Express" and liked it. Also saw a British Hammer horror film about an evil Oriental named Fu Manchu. Oriental women strike me as pretty.
Orient, oriental, orient, oriental, orient, oriental.
Oh, no! I'm cancelled! Orient, oriental, orient, oriental! Hey, I even like oriental food!
ORIENT!!! ORIENTAL!!!!
Asia is east only from a Western perspective, but this doesn't disqualify it as a reason.
“The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men should do nothing.”
We should not give this forum over to anti-American
pro-Russian trolls.
That reminds me of the following funny exchange:
HCUA: Are you now, or have you ever been, a member of the Communist Party?
Communist: We're not allowed to say.