Would Objectivism be more widely accepted had Ayn Rand been a man?
Posted by coaldigger 6 years, 3 months ago to Philosophy
Maybe this would not be true today but in 1957 I think a female philosopher would have had a more difficult time being taken seriously outside of LA and New York. Even Bennett Cerf didn't think much of her ideology but thought the book might make a little money.
I think that one has to reject altruism in every form starting with religion to accept Objectivism and that is the greatest hurdle since modern humans exhibited some for of religion since their exodus from Africa 50,000 years ago. Female prophets have been fewer in number and less influential than their male counterparts and I think this has been a part of the hurdle. Her successors, Brandon and Peikoff were too cerebral and competitive with each other to make her works a popular message, leaving acceptance in scattered enclaves.
I think that one has to reject altruism in every form starting with religion to accept Objectivism and that is the greatest hurdle since modern humans exhibited some for of religion since their exodus from Africa 50,000 years ago. Female prophets have been fewer in number and less influential than their male counterparts and I think this has been a part of the hurdle. Her successors, Brandon and Peikoff were too cerebral and competitive with each other to make her works a popular message, leaving acceptance in scattered enclaves.
It isn't so much prejudice that makes the appearance of women in professional life historically rare, but the biological fact that only women can bear children, which occupies a lot of time. Women with determination have been able to capture the reins of power in seemingly impossible situations. Hatshepsut seized the throne of ancient Egypt, in an era when only men were supposed to be the pharaoh, as one example. Sarah Breedlove, otherwise known as Madam C.J. Walker, daughter of a slave, was the first American female millionaire, as another.
I think Ayn Rand herself would have laughed at the idea she was hampered by her sex. She would have told you it was her unsettling message that upset people.
Most people are not objective (religious or non religious)...makes no difference who or what suggests otherwise.
All of us here put no stock into whether the philosophy comes from a male or female.
zine and someone(at_ PLAYBOY_) talking to Hugh Hefner and say-
ing something about his proposing to carry more intellectual ideas; and then (this is a memory quote) "Do you really think our audience will dig a full-color layout of Ayn Rand?" When I first read it, I simply did not understand it, as I had no idea of who Ayn Rand was, I didn't even know whether it was a man's or a woman's name, and I didn't see the point of the joke. When I looked it over again later, I understood. Of course, there was an inter-
view, and I don't think she would have posed for a centerfold. But then people did like to throw mud at her, especially now that she's dead and can't come back to defend herself. (I mean that this joke appeared in MAD, I don't buy PLAYBOY).
I think what makes her work difficult to accept is that most people have a view of altruism whether promoted by the state, their religion or their political party and this makes it very difficult for them to accept her work and reconcile what they already believe to be true.
My experience with Objectivists is that they are absolutists in that if something has been proven by empirical evidence, by observation, by reason then any fool should see it, agree and proceed accordingly without guidance. Only a few people are wired to do this naturally and due to the mental effort required, many would rather accept what others have concluded on faith. The problem is that we have to occupy this planet with everyone else and we are too few. Past civilizations have controlled the lazy, the uninformed and the stupid by coercion, either by scaring them or brute force.
Ayn Rand saw America with the principles of Representative Democracy and Capitalism as a beacon of reason and individual liberty. America seemed to be the hope for mankind and she provided a clear means to realizing that potential instead of falling into the abyss of altruism like most of the world. Unfortunately, she came to this conclusion on her own, by her own will and viewed anyone that could not accept her philosophy instantly in its entirety as a dolt and told them so.
The spokesmen for Objectivism that I follow are cut from the same cloth as Rand and are against anything that is not Objectivist purity. Incremental progress is hateful to them and they reject any notion of it. The enemy however thrives on every chip they can take no matter how small. Progressives want the state to regulate toothpicks as much as they want to regulate energy. It is all the same. Chip away freedom where ever it is found, no matter how big or small and it will all add up to complete control. Objectivists think big but are being killed by a thousand tiny cuts. Collectivism is a regression in human organization and was only able to coexist with individual freedom in hunter-gather societies. It takes external force to move anything into an unnatural state and to make modern society work under collectivism, the state must have total power and has to murder those it cannot control.
My premise is that we are in a life of death struggle and unless a movement emerges that can incrementally change the path we are on, all of the progress in the history of the modern world is in jeopardy. A movement requires a leader, a prophet, a teacher, communicator, a charismatic figure to inform and inspire the majority not just a few hard heads demanding overnight change.
Her ideas met with the same hatred from the establishment as would be expected from any man. The establishment took her ideas seriously, which is why they hated her and demonized her work.
Ironically, it was reading Atlas Shrugged that forever cured me of those anarchic/mystical delusions.
From the Wikipedia article: {[Shevik, the novel's protagonist] says, “You are all in jail. Each alone, solitary, with a heap of what he owns. You live in prison, die in prison. It is all I can see in your eyes – the wall, the wall!” It is not just the state of mind of those inside the prisons that concerns Shevek, he also notes the effect on those outside the walls. Steve Grossi says, ‘by building a physical wall to keep the bad in, we construct a mental wall keeping ourselves, our thoughts, and our empathy out, to the collective detriment of all." Shevek himself later says, “those who build walls are their own prisoners.”}
Reminiscent of Anthem's collectivist society's censure of the self-referential "I," on Anarres {the use of the possessive case is strongly discouraged, a feature that also is reflected by the novel's title. Children are trained to speak only about matters that interest others; anything else is "egoizing" (pp. 28–31). There is no property ownership of any kind. Shevek's daughter, upon meeting him for the first time, tells him, "You can share the handkerchief I use" rather than "You may borrow my handkerchief", thus conveying the idea that the handkerchief is not owned by the girl, but is merely used by her.}
You see, it is the moral premise---not it's practical or psychological consequences that makes all the difference. There are amazing parallels between the two, but on fundamentals the two women were diametric opposites (Rand the Neo-Aristotlean individualist, Le Guin the Taoist, Neo-Platonic collectivist).
I kind of feel like Shevek myself, only I finally turned my back on the world of Anarres completely, resolving instead to fight for the Atlantean principles of Urras (as it could be and should be).
Your statement (as worded) implies pragmatism and is self-contradictory (the third and fourth sentences specifically). It is pragmatism that takes "experience" as axiomatic.
The gender distinction in the realm of ideas and their role in human survival is completely lost on me. Gender is a concrete, and it matters on a personal (not ideational) level. (I.e., you must experience your values in some form, but may experience them in any form appropriate to your biological nature as a male or female human being.
"Race," plays no rational role whatsoever. So her being female was important to her as a person (as distinct from her philosophy), while her slavic or semitic ancestry was not.
It seems to me people tell women sacrifice is a virtue more than they tell that to men. (That's just a feeling; I don't have evidence.) But if I'm right about that, Rand could be seen as "feminist" because she's an example of a woman who says she's putting her desires first.
I agree, and I think that's why it will never be a mainstream philosophy.
"Female prophets..."
Not sure why this even becomes an issue. If you're going to denounce religion, you're going to denounce prophets as well - male or female - because the primary role of a prophet is as a spiritual leader who converses with the divine. Why cast Ayn Rand as a "prophet" in the first place? Doesn't make any sense to me...
"Brandon and Peikoff were too cerebral and competitive..."
Another reason why Objectivism will never be a mainstream philosophy. You can't fracture a movement and then expect it to stay together. There has to be clear and unambiguous leadership and I don't think that exists in Objectivism, whereas Buddhism has the Dalai Lama, Catholicism has the Pope, Marxism has Marx and Stalin and now Bernie Sanders, and the Democratic Party has George Soros and the Clintons (though the Obamas would love to steal that mantle). I would point out that probably the only reason Islam hasn't completely dominated the globe is because early on it fractured into Sunni and Shiite based on claims to leadership and authority which have had them at perpetual war for more than a millennia.
Ayn Rand is the authority over, not "the movement," but the philosophy she fully explicated. Applications must be judged on that basis alone (or you end up with a philosophy not of principles but of attitudes, of disintegration rather than integration).
That's why leadership is important: you have to have someone to assume the role of the founder and prevent fractures. That was Peter's role after Christ died - until he was martyred and Christianity fragmented. Islam split because two sons claimed right of authority and split into Sunni and Shia (and later added Wahab and Baathism). Judaism fractured when the Jews were taken captive by other civilizations and now you have several sub-sects of the Jewish religion. You can argue that fascism, socialism, and communism are all facets or fractures of the same ideology as well - an ideology of elitism and control.
Another (as yet far less known) leading authority on Objectivism is philosopher Charles Tew, who has roundly denounced the Atlas Society skeptics here: https://youtu.be/Bp_8a91wjNQ
I especially like the point he makes at 4:30 on "the connection between skepticism and disintegration":
"If you think you might always be wrong about something, then you're not going to put things together, you're not going to interconnect things, because then if one thing falls the rest falls over.
"So you are going to disintegrate habitually to save yourself from the constant overturning that's taking place, or that you expect to take place as a skeptic.
"And this is exactly what the Atlas Society does: 'No [they say] Objectivism isn't a system, it's just a collection of ideas, and it's really whatever we want to believe it is. It's really a synonym for "truth." So if Ayn Rand was wrong about "free will" then we can throw out "free will" and keep the rest.'
"Now that is not necessarily a dishonest position. You could believe that some part of Ayn Rand's philosophy is wrong. But to believe that and then to promote yourself as an Objectivist, as an advocate of her philosophy, is dishonest and immoral."
On the issue of Christianity, I will recommend the Valliant/Fahy book: "Creating Christ: How Roman Emperors Invented Christianity" available for $6 on Kindle: http://a.co/d/1Q9pbUl
Equivocating means trying to play both sides or waffling between them. I have clearly delineated that there is the philosophy 1 but that without leadership, the philosophy dies off, 2. I would ask you to explain where you see in this any measure of equivocation or why this was worthy of a downvote. Part of debate is hearing things you don't necessarily agree with.
I still believe that authority is key, however, to the perpetuation of any philosophy. The fact that I had never heard of most of those individuals you mention is evidence to me that there is little or no real leadership among Objectivists. Now I fully agree that part of the Objectivist creed in many ways belies strong leadership (which is why I bring up John Galt) but the question is how does Objectivism expand. The answer is that there must be a concerted effort, and concerted effort always requires leadership to get that done. It isn't a philosophical issue with Objectivism to me nearly as much as just a structural/organizational issue.
Please note also that I do not equate leadership with homage or payment of fees necessarily. I do equate leadership with vision, organization, and motivation. However much I despise the ethics of people like Bill Clinton or Barack Obama, they are effective leaders. I can't think of many on the Republican side that exude the same kind of charisma, which may account for their seeming lack of uniformity.
As far as an overall umbrella organization for the philosophy is concerned, that is and always has been the Ayn Rand Institute, which prevents no one from seeking inspiration or application elsewhere.
Other groups have formed out (or in at least one case against) ARI, but whoever holds the rights is in fact in authority for now and until some organization(s) gain the rights to Ayn Rand's estate.
I personally think every actual Objectivist is their own authority and should be organizing that authority on whatever scale they are able or willing (such as starting a Meetup group (DC has a big one), Youtube channel (e.g., Charles Tew's), Campus Club (e.g., STRIVE), Special Interest Group (e.g., Alex Epstein's).... The list is potentially endless.
I apologize for downvotes which I flick too quickly to simply signal (some) disagreement. But this is not FB and I should be more judicious less impulsive. Good post, sir. :-)
Part 2 of that book is Ayn Rand's private journal documenting the injustice she endured at the time the charade was being committed.
1) To foretell
or:
2) To forth tell
I think that the word "prophet" is very applicable to Ayn. Anyone who can think in abstractions like she could certainly would be considered to be prophetic.
I think thay words are often given religious meaning when they aren't religious at all.
Actually, given that atheism is a very recent development in human history, I would argue that you have that backwards: most words were religious before modern atheism attempted to secularize them. The Oracle at Delphi was called a "prophetess" because her duty was to speak the will of the Gods to the people. In Hebrew the word prophet always meant someone who communicated with God on behalf of the people - Moses being the prime example. The key was that their knowledge of the future - and thus their "forthtelling" was a divine gift - not mortal prescience. That's why were Rand here herself, I believe she would object strongly to being characterized as such.
The fact remains that she predicted the future in a most remarlable way.
I completely agree. It is more than a matter of mere ideas - there has to be a certain passion or conviction behind the ideas which inspire the sharing of those ideas with others (beyond works of fiction). And there has to be some end in mind beyond mere intellectual stimulation for it to affect any but the fringe academic. When Objectivism can define THAT and a real life John Galt steps forward to advance that vision, only then can it begin to expand and become mainstream. Every major religion or philosophy has had it - from the Ancient Greeks to modern Marxism and everything in between. In marketing speak, there has to be a "hook" somewhere - something that compels the audience to action. What is the hook Objectivism offers? (If someone could kindly rewrite Galt's speech down to something digestible in 10 pages that would be a good start.)
ment occurred.
What is interesting to note is that despite the Protestant Reformation, the Catholic Church remains the single largest Christian sect. I don't think that would have happened without the leadership position of Pope. Even the Orthodox Churches (Greek and Russian) went to a single leader with the title of "Archbishop" because the council of bishops which formed their original leadership structures proved too divisive and unwieldy. We could look at a host of other similar leadership-driven organizations from Red China to North Korea to Stalinist Russia to Hitler's Germany to see other examples where leadership is (or was) everything.
If we look at Atlas Shrugged, I think that Rand portrayed Galt as the leader intentionally. Indeed, Galt served as the rallying cry when imprisoned and galvanized the rest to action, and was the original impetus behind the formation and population of Atlantis in the first place. Where the phrase "who is John Galt?" is more typically used to indicate a kind of tongue-in-cheek recognition that bad policy leads to bad results, it could also be a rallying cry to the Objectivist to find a John Galt-type character to organize and lead the Objectivist movement.