If Brinksmanship Does Spur a Debate on Spending, What Will?

Posted by CircuitGuy 11 years, 2 months ago to Government
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I've only read one or two articles, but what amazes me most is we *still* don't have a discussion (that I've heard) about drastically scaling back spending.

My guess is apart from PPACA histrionics, they're doing the usual "we need to cut spending, but without cutting military, Social Security, or Medicare." That makes no sense since those things are most of the budget.

The fed gov't provides more than half the retirement income for more than half of the retired people. The US military spends almost as much as all the other countries combined b/c we're supposedly the only ones holding it together. If we don't question these assumptions now, when will we ever? Do we just wait until rates rise and servicing the debt is half the budget? I guess that's what it will take, but as an engineer I find that a very inefficient way of doing things.


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  • Posted by Hiraghm 11 years, 2 months ago
    The defense budget is justified because that is within the mandate of the federal government... but it *could* have minor cuts and major savings if we had a coherent foreign policy.

    But the greatest revenue enhancement would come from decimating the federal bureaucracy. Removing the host of redundant and unConstitutional executive departments.
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    • Posted by LionelHutz 11 years, 2 months ago
      No no no. Of course spending money on defense is justified in principle. Suggesting a cut is not saying otherwise. He's saying "can we please sit down and look at what we're spending on defense and find places to make cuts?" It completely does not make sense to rule out cuts from the largest areas you are spending money in. He's right on point there.

      Taken from here (which you won't be able to get to at the moment, because of govt shutdown):
      http://www.census.gov/compendia/statab/c...

      Here's ten big places we're spending our money (I think the numbers are in billions, but can't load the site to verify):

      117.5 Social Security - on budget
      127.1 Retirement and Disability - federal employees
      134.8 Unemployment Compensation
      151.9 National Defense - Procurement
      157.0 National Defense - military personnel
      176.6 "other" income security
      311.9 National Defense - operations and maintenance
      347.0 Health care services
      430.4 Interest paid out on Treasury Bills
      494.3 Medicare

      My two cents: eliminate Medicare D.
      On the military side of things, I'll suggest a cut. Just how many aircraft carriers do we need? Check this out:
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ai...

      You'll notice we've got 10, our UK ally has 2, and except for Italy, everyone else has zero or one. Justification please? Why can't we make this four? One active for Atlantic and Pacific far deployment, and one in near deployment for training and reserve/backup.
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      • Posted by 11 years, 2 months ago
        I like the idea of not having a large standing army and instead having some sort of regulated militia that train once a year or more. We would have a small standing army. If a WWII situation develops, we jump into action and build up weapons.

        The argument against this, as I understand it, is the US military is providing the defense for the entire world and if we didn't do it no one would do it. I don't see that, but I'm open to new information.
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      • Posted by Hiraghm 11 years, 2 months ago
        It's 1939. Please tell me how many aircraft carriers we need?
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        • Posted by LionelHutz 11 years, 2 months ago
          This response is baffling. By the reasoning I think you're expressing here, maybe we should be building like 50 more aircraft carriers just to be on the safe side?
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          • Posted by Hiraghm 11 years, 2 months ago
            You think wrong.
            I said it's 1939. The battleship still dominates naval warfare.

            There are two truths of military history:
            Generals are always ready to fight the last war.
            No battle plan survives contact with the enemy.

            The Confederate War was so bloody because they were using 50 year old tactics on a more modern battlefield with more accurate weapons.

            the Chinese have come up with an aircraft carrier destroying missile. Now how many should we have?

            Due to our increased respect and affection around the world, our "allies" either force us to leave our airbases (which we hopefully destroy on the way out) in their nations, or simply refuse us overflight. Iran is about to launch an all-out nuclear attack on Israel, involving aircraft delivery as well as missile, and is seen building an invasion force in its southern regions.
            Our four aircraft carriers are off dealing with made-up issues, instigated by Iran and/or their allies in order to draw our 4 aircraft carriers out of the region.
            Now what do you do?

            Mothballing ships costs money, too.

            Space aliens invade destroying our land-based military installations, but for some reason fail to attack our navy (logistics and cultural issues, most likely). How many carriers do we need then?

            Maybe we should be building 50 more aircraft carriers, since we may well have to take on a China AND Russia AND the moslem world, all equipped with the capability of destroying aircraft carriers.
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            • Posted by LionelHutz 11 years, 2 months ago
              I'm sorry, but I have to say this is not a good demonstration of coherent thought. The original poster was bringing up that nobody is giving serious discussion to budget cuts in several areas, including the military. Please tell me if you see any areas where you would cut the military budget. You are coming off like any money spent here is automatically a good thing, which is exactly the point the OP was critical of. Is this your position? We have to keep what we have to cover things like the scenario where space aliens invade?
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