Bitcoin too 'libertarian' for Hillary Clinton
"The digital currency Bitcoin is too 'libertarian' and reliant on an 'Ayn Rand schtick,' Hillary Clinton campaign chairman John Podesta said in an exchange with campaign tech aide Teddy Goff published by WikiLeaks on Tuesday."
Bitcoin is definitely an inferior currency.
Bitcoin is a great way to send gold electronically.
I can buy gold with bitcoin. It's a great way to move digital value back to something real.
Maybe crypto-currencies will be like the phone and mail. Those use to be the two ways to contact someone over a distance. Then came e-mail. Now there are so many services people use. Some people don't use e-mail or phone as much. They're on Skype, WhatsApp, Slack, Google Messenger, and FB. There's not one thing that everyone uses. If the gov't keeps borrowing and it leads to a monetary crisis, I could see people just abandoning the USD. Agreements would be in USD but indexed to other currencies or futures contracts. It would be confusing but would save the economy. In this scenario, central bank currencies would stay around like the Plain Old Telephone Service (POTS), obsolete and slowly becoming too expensive to maintain given dwindling usage.
No government can have any control over it since there is nothing centralized about it. The only way a government could stop it within it's own borders would be to completely shut down access to internet and cell phone service.
Definition-
"Fiat money is a currency established as money by government regulation or law. The term derives from the Latin fiat ("let it be done", "it shall be") used in the sense of an order or decree. It differs from commodity money and representative money."
In the case of Bitcoin, we are talking about an actual commodity money. Yes the commodity is derived from electricity and computing power, but it still has value if people believe it has value. While gold can be useful in certain manufacturing aspects, it is not the most efficient mineral to be used in any particular case. It has value because people have decided to give it value. No different than Bitcoin.
Bingo. To me, because it has no physical backing, they could fold up shop (or get shut down by a government) and I'm hosed. Just like I will be in twenty years when our debt crushes us... Wait a minute... ;)
It's rare and limited, it takes work to mine it, it has recognized value.
The same is true with Bitcoin, it to is rare and limited, it requires work to mine it, and it has a recognized trade value.
Both are fungible, immutable, and tangible.
I can buy gold with bitcoin, and vice-versa.
Fiat is just created out of thin air, and its value is based on faith in a gov't
I'm not trying to say that bitcoin isn't valuable. I'm just pointing out that it exists only ethereally. There is nothing tangible about it.
Provident Metals (there are a few others as well) accept bitcoin.
It doesn't have to intangible. You can print it out (called a paper wallet) and give it to someone. You can also drop that piece of paper on the ground and lose it just as you a dollar or a coin.
>That is the very definition of a fiat currency
Yes, our problem is we replaced golds value with trust.
If Bitcoin got pegged to gold - then it would be an electronic form of gold
Agreed.
It would have lots of other uses were it not so hard to acquire - thus the reason it is expensive. Because bitcoin has no use other then as a medium of exchange (even if the supply is limited) I do not trust it to hold its value. To be money a commodity has to have three characteristics: "The main functions of money are as a medium of exchange, a unit of account, and a store of value." While bitcoin could serve these functions if there were some way to insure that it remained a store of value, given that there are no other uses of bitcoin (as there are gold) its value depends entirely on the willingness of others to accept it in exchange for something of value to them. Unlike other forms of money, bitcoin is not a useful commodity.
Source: Boundless. “Functions of Money.” Boundless Business. Boundless, 08 Aug. 2016. Retrieved 20 Oct. 2016 from https://www.boundless.com/business/te...
You may not be aware of this, but gold is incredibly useful in computer electronics. Most leads connecting a microprocessor use gold because it is a great conductor of electricity and can be pulled into very small wires. Yes, it is pretty and rare, but people also put it on cakes (weird people with money to burn).
"It's all relative."
Ultimately, all value is.
I think we both would agree that fiat currency is complete B.S. and is only good as long as a government exists to back it. I would argue that Bitcoin definitely does not fall into that category of fiat currency, however. It is a commodity, just a rather strange one, perhaps like tulip bulbs...
What I would think might be interesting is to see a banking system similar to what existed before the Federal Reserve took control: a system where government couldn't control money at all and regional banks had to literally compete for their value in the market. If bitcoin leads to that kind of system, I'm all in!
Not to mention, there are several other types of digital currency like Litecoin and Etherium that compete with Bitcoin. You could look a those as different banks in the same way.
Hey, it passes the time until Armageddon.
Of course using AR in an ad hominem attack is always convenient for LibProgs.
I reserve judgment on Bitcoin, pending further research. But my current reservations are mainly that it's "value" is totally subjective, and not based in reality, as opposed to say, gold is. As far as being able to print a paper receipt, as I've seen in some comments, I fail to see how that is in any way different than any other fiat paper currency backed with nothing. But, I am always open to further research, and would like to hear feedback on links etc. to the best objective articles arguing that Bitcoin is, or could one day be, accepted as a true universal medium of exchange.
Internet (though perhaps Galt's Daily Gulch is a
redeeming feature), and I don't understand very
well the concept of "digital currency". I don't see
much "libertarian" or "Ayn Rand" about it. I like
physical, cash money. Gold would be nice, also
silver, but paper dollars would be all right if they
had the proper metal in back of them. I'm not
even too fond of checks. When I have to send
money through the mail, I generally send a mon-
ey order.
It would be nice if the government were for-
bidden to print money, and it were done by priv-
ate companies, who would be subject to being
charged with fraud if they misrepresented the
weight/amount of metal in back of their bills/notes.--And then, perhaps the government
should be permitted to print some money--
some sort of government paper scrip, to pay
the armed service personnel, with a certain a-
mount of weight/metal printed on the front of
the bills/notes, guaranteed.
Bitcoin can actually even be printed into physical form, but nobody would want to accept it without first verifying it is legitimate with an internet connection.
The great things about Bitcoin are: 1. There is only so much of it and never will be more than a certain amount. It cannot be changed (no new money printing). 2. It cannot be counterfeited. 3. No single entity controls it at all. Hundreds of thousands (or millions) of users control it at the same time. It is a simple set of rules that cannot be broken. It really is something incredible.
if so, what metal? Gold,silver, copper, platinum,
tin? Can you hold it in your hand?
I like things to be real. I don't even like when
magazines want me to give up printed copies
in favor getting copies sent over the Internet,
things which can come and just vanish, and
be wiped out with a button.--But you're right if
you think I don't understand digital currency.
I do believe that BitCoin is a commendable effort toward wresting control of "money" from the Rulers to the individuals. It's a part of the rush to a digital world, in which nothing is real, and the gibberish of so-called "smart" phones is taking over.
For example, when the Great Global Collapse finally hits, will the Rulers pull the plug? Then will we continue to have electricity paid for with blips in the cyberworld?
I agree. All value is in people serving one another and making things for one another in mutual trades. We need to work together and serve one another to live. As it says in AS, you can make that happen under threats or let people do it voluntarily using money, there are no other ways.
True. It helps in immensely, so much that it's a "need" for me. I'm fully domesticated, and wouldn't do well on my own. Humans are adapted to travel in clans.