Help Me Understand This...
In one community recently, the local authorities were all puffed up over a family having a purple jungle set in their back yard and some of the locals didn't agree with the aesthetic. (Apparently the little girls for whom the swing set was erected liked purple. Go figure.). The authorities were promising fines, etc. if the family didn't take it down.
Fast forward to today in Orlando, Florida. It seems a local there has his own reality TV show. He also has lethal reptiles in his home. Well darn the luck, one got out the other day. Sadly, he forgot to mention it to anyone like, oh say, the cops for several days. Turns out the escapee is an EIGHT FOOT KING COBRA, which can grow to 14 feet. Further, said snake owner opined the the beast probably went into a local wooded area and most likely we'll never be found. Not to worry though...he probably won't bite anyone.
Is this a great country or what??!?!
Fast forward to today in Orlando, Florida. It seems a local there has his own reality TV show. He also has lethal reptiles in his home. Well darn the luck, one got out the other day. Sadly, he forgot to mention it to anyone like, oh say, the cops for several days. Turns out the escapee is an EIGHT FOOT KING COBRA, which can grow to 14 feet. Further, said snake owner opined the the beast probably went into a local wooded area and most likely we'll never be found. Not to worry though...he probably won't bite anyone.
Is this a great country or what??!?!
As for the dangerous reptiles, I do not think that the government should have control over our lives, as Mamaemma said. However, I think SaltyDog's point was that the king cobra snake owner wasn't even fined for letting his snake go into the wild. This is a form of gross negligence or reckless endangerment that a society can reasonably sanction the former owner after the negligence.
A snake will act out of instinct. It has no free will to act a different way if it feels threatened.
I have absolutely no problem with non-lethal snakes.
When the animal is a slithering potential "deadly weapon" that can strike at any time, there is a real threat that should be dealt with or the thought of ownership availability should be re-examined thoroughly.
The biggest difference between guns, prescription meds, and knives vs. snakes is that the snake is a living, mobile threat. The other items have to be used by a human being to be a threat. Presumably that human being is capable of acting on his/her own responsibly.
I can see both sides of the problem over the purple jungle set. I live in a small town where a person who owned a large building painted it a very bright shade of pink. The people who live near this structure saw their property values go down, and they also lost some of their peace and quiet because of all the cars driving by to take a look.
This country could use some common sense.
P.S. Add these to your list: Lois Lerner called us a seven letter word that starts with "A", McCain called us crazies, and Hillary compared us to terrorists.
This name calling is supposed to intimidate us into shutting up.
This issue actually is similar to the immigration issue we all have discussed recently when it comes to the infringement aspect. I think that SaltyDog and I are quicker to take offense about infringements on society, whereas most of the people in this forum are offended more quickly when the rights of the individual are infringed upon. Both are affronts and deserve our indignation.
To expect the neighbors to bring a lawsuit is really too much of a burden on the neighbors. They have already been punished by their irresponsible neighbor. To have to go to court to get justice is more trouble than it is worth, unless, of course, the king cobra kills one of your family members (or more likely, pets).
About a dozen years ago I was vice president of a Homeowner's Association in good old California. It was a high end new development. Rules were strict about almost everything, and everyone who bought in (or rented there, or purchased a used home) had to agree to the then current CC&R's as part of their recorded deed.
For a certain percentage of homeowners, the CC&R's represented something representing authority for them to attack, almost constantly. On homeowner built a custom home and painted the outside quite gaudily (almost purple, actually) in defiance, and had his lawyer present at every conversation where we pointed out his transgressions. (Did I mention he was a leftist history professor who had recently won a Pulitzer, which he reminded everyone of at each meeting?)
But I digress, and here's the point:
IF one gives one's word (signs an agreement, executes a contract, use your own vernacular) is he or she not bound to that agreement, and if he/she chooses not to comply with it, then of course he/she (gotta be PC) has the opportunity to relocate and thereby void the agreement? As others on the list point out, it is a choice, and free people make choices. Free people also keep their agreements, IMHO. The idea that it's "unfair" or "takes away my rights" is to me invalid since one has already made an agreement giving away certain rights.
By the way, I resigned after one year. It was a constant fight. One of the rules in the CC&R's was that "garage doors shall always be closed." Yet somehow everyone was able to get into and out of their garages, apparently without breaking the rules. You buy into fascism, that's what you get.
This post represents, in many ways, the irrational world that we are immersed in and that we fight against everyday.
Well stated,indeed.
Legal satisfaction was through the military education center testing program. Later it was the external degree programs in three states.
One day I received a Bachelors in the mail. Another day a second Bachelors. Some years later and a bit more difficult one step up.
Useful but not enough to produce an income equal to what I made in the blue color skilled trades. I just through that in to explain my sometimes spelling and somewhat eclectic interests.
But I think (and perhaps Mamaemma does not) that the moment that one of them wiggles a scale over the property edge, the owner is At That Moment guilty of having released a harmful animal into the environment. You do not have to wait for the snake to bite someone - right then, you go after the owner with the demand that he pay for a competent search for the reptile until it is captured or until he runs out of money. The owner is still legally responsible if the cobra bites someone - but that is a criminal charge.
I think that you can do anything that is legal on your own property, but that 'it' cannot transverse the border of your land.
Jan
I ask this because I lived in the northeast US. We had (and might still have) a big problem with Gypsy Moth Caterpillars.
The caterpillar is not native to the area. It was accidentally released (I think in the late 1800s) by a scientist who was trying to find a better silk by researching Asian silk worms and caterpillars. To the researcher's credit, he immediately notified the local and federal authorities. The government ended up doing nothing. One hundred years later, during its peak cycle, millions of acres of forest are destroyed by these little bastards.
So, what to do? It should be the individual's responsibility to clean up their mess. But with living things, a situation can quickly get beyond an individual's ability to responsibility control. And do we want a government which legislates away potential threats (the excuse for much of its current overreach and abuse)?
Your comments are welcome.
As I see it, the following are options.
a) An overactive government decides that such pets can no longer be pets. That is an overreach.
b) A government or homeowners' association fines them for infringing upon the safety of the neighborhood. There has been some harm done here, simply by people no longer feeling comfortable to let their kids loose in their backyards.
c) Move along. Nothing to see here.
d) Have someone whose family member or pet was killed sue for damages, after a tragic loss. Money can make up for some things, but not life.
This really is a fascinating debate the Gulch will have.
This rapidly evolves into the preventative use of force which doesn't seem very attractive. I guess you could claim you are using retaliatory force against the probabilistic future act that forcefully impacts your rights.
But that slope isn't just slippery, it's greased.
When you are dealing with unrealized risks the word 'proved' becomes very important.
Call in: (712) 775-7031, ACCESS CODE: 560-722
If it were me, I'd do nothing. The snake will probably take off in search of food. Now if it were a case like the Gypsy Moth Caterpillars, I think I'd do some research and see if some predator which eats them can be introduced without creating a worse problem than it solves. But if I thought the answer was yes, I'd ask the city council for permission first, because I don't want to p off my neighbors. I have to live with them.
Jan
Jan
"No Senor it means naked or nude.It's a local term.What you are thinking of is perra in the polite sense and bruja for wha tyou of thinking. That of course is the feminine gender version of perro or dog. The burger itself is one piece of very high grade ground round with nothing else on the platter ergo naked.
So Bichi or Bici burger but beware there is also bicha a snake, biche green and bicho a wierd sort of odd ball all pronounced the same.
Which brings us back to doing something au natural or in proper Spanish desnudo. That wasn't in the dictionary but nudo was and it means (k)not. No relation but one must be careful. Some perfectly harmless words aren't A saying is if you like the mother you will love the daughter. but the local phrase is gusta la vaca amo la becerra. cow and calf. You may say that and refer to the daughter as a calf but you may not refer to the mother as a vaca or cow. that would mean very very wide to be polite. That word is gordo or grueso but gross is grocera not meaning 144 unless it's kilos while the store for food is groceria.
The moral of the story is have a two language dictionary in the hand that doesn't have the cold beer and mind the brizna de pasco y su dedos. Blades of grass for your fingers (also means toes) especially if you are grocera sin ropa and mowing the lawn. Ropa is clothes. Helping at the dock don't say throw me su ropa ask for a soga which can also ve used to make fun of your Spanish or warn you of being in dire straits
Ask the why the prefer Spanish they will tell you English is too difficult.
When you go to the next state or region it will all change. they do that to get a good laugh.
the final caution for safe nude lawn mowing is the slang for a certain other appendage is pistol. i let you guess the rest.
Save me a beer.
Jan
Jan
But in general - there may be people that want to live in a quite (color or noise, etc.) community and signed a group agreement on the matter
(the HOA CC&R's). This is an explicit contract.
Other folks may like living next to bright pink and green houses, using drums and jack hammers as entertainment - or at least taking the risk without and local/neighborhood CC&R's. Other like to collect appliances and vehicles and park them in the front, side, and back yards,
Hmmm.
Jan
The organizing principle of any society is the protection of the weak, and at some point and in some areas of our lives, we're all weak. As to government overreach, that almost seems inevitable any more.
Innocent until proven or found guilty. what about someone who sends their child to school with the flu?
You bring up a good point regarding the flu, or any other infectious desease and associated immunizations. I've been on the fence on this issue. Seems to me that both sides have valid points. In Japan people voluntarily put masks on when they have a flu, yet I remember when my son was in child care, there was one kid who had green crap running out of his nose all the time and we had to keep our son home because of that (while paying for the child care). Eventually, the resolution was to pull our kid out of that childcare. But that begs a question - does the owner of the childcare has the right to stop the infectious kid?
I have a right to my property. If someone stronger or better armed comes to take it, it's the responsibility of government to either prevent it of have my property returned and/or I be made whole. The opposite is anarchy.
Anarchists are the extremists of the right. By definition of zero government they are loners.Anything above that would constitute the start of a government.
The left or the opposite extremists are the Nazis, the Communists, the skin heads, and so forth at the extremes of the left which are any group proposing, actively carrying out or supporting government control of the citizens.
Fascist simply means complete government control of everything using any and all means available. The government you are referring to is right smack dab in the middle usually calling for citizen control through rights and responsibilities with some limited government. One part of which is usually law enforcement and the other is military defense. They may stretch from the center but always are attached to and support the center and NEVER violate the basic tenets, beliefs, and rights as set forth by the citizens.
For us the best description of the center was the Constitution. The right or near right probably Libertarians and a few others just to use the direction. The left of course starts, for us, with a coalition of two plus parties the Republicans, the Democrats and a few odds and ends Independents. All of which believe in government control of citizens and most by virtue of their recent actions versus their rhetoric believing in complete control of the citizens. The only connection the Republicans have with the right is they are the right wing of the left. .
So....if the individual(s) coming for your property are the government to whom do you turn? And having found the answer please share it the job is completely open.
Everyone needs protection from superior force.
Jan
I don't think we have anything further to discuss.
FWE
FWE means Finished With Engines. When the ship is secured to her berth, this tells the engine
room that the particular voyage is over and we
have no further need of you.
Moreover, the basic legal case is called TERRY VERSUS OHIO. Terry was a convicted felon, stopped and frisked outside a jewelry store. The police found a gun. He sued. He lost.
for you. . it overrides your judgment,,, in the color of swingsets
or the nature of pets,,, so that you should adopt MY ideas just 'cuz ........
well, just 'cuz I am ME and you are not. . so there!!!
and it I have the power, watch out -- ME counts over YOU. -- j
.
.
Like jbrenner, I don't like excess rules from government. However, if one is negligent and there are consequences, one is responsible.
I hope this helps you figure it out...
Kids run rampant all over the place. I get a bit paranoid - clearing the yard of black widows and snakes. Lots of black widows here too. I friggin hate those things! They are nasty.
And, the negligence of waiting to inform authorities that might have been able to quickly contain the situation?
Exotic dangerous animals should not be allowed in residential areas. Wild animals in cages?! I find this cruel and unusual punishment. But I have a hard time accepting the rationale behind a zoo (maybe a long time ago before television).
If a child got wounded or killed by a gun accidentally left unguarded... well... you would be considered responsible and there would be hell to pay. IMHO, this dangerous animal is no different.
I don't like green I was in the Army...I object to green lawns.
Same type of reasoning.
I I wanted my life to look like yours I would have been born stupid.
Same level of answer.
As to the snake guy. He's liable and so is his home owners insurance and so is the local government. If I was Orlando's carrier I'd be dropping that policy like in a NY Second.
Florida is home to some rather large snakes of it's own. Western Duvall Country a few years ago saw one rattler long enough (once killed) to drape from a tall man's shoulders with both ends touching the ground. Maybe one will eat the other? Maybe deputize the rattler?
The rest went into her retirement account. We are thinking of buying one down south of the border and she's looking at an RV the same way I looked at a boat.
But who cares? I also read the statement that Already Deadly As Hell Huge-Assed King Cobra probably won't bite anyone.
So move along. Nothing to see here, folks.
One thing is for sure. Me dino will damn well move on.
Me dino don't wanna see nuttin' near or about that snake-handling bozo's bungle in the jungle place.
fy as a member of an endangered species, mightn't
it? And besides, man must learn to live in accord
with nature, mustn't he? So what if a few human
beings get killed?--As to the purple jungle swing
set in the backyard on private property, anybody
knows, doesn't he, that anything on private
property that defends the aesthetics of one's
neighbors is an unthinkable atrocity?!
This IS a great country -- no or what about it.