Atlantis must be free
Posted by upston 10 years ago to Philosophy
Atlantis must be free or why bother.
Many of us chafe at the ever increasing grip Governments exert on their citizens
here in the US and around the world. The list ranges from the trivial like your toilet flush capacity or type of light bulb to the serious matters of choosing a doctor or school for the next generation. The list gets longer every day.
So if Atlantis is to offer any real relief it’s inhabitants must enjoy all the freedoms we have let slip away. “ In the public interest” they tell us. I see many forum comments on this subject each with a different spin on a new society but at the root of it all is the need to manifest a new destiny without big brothers help, for better or worse.
Al Gore, our oafish and misguided VP was wrong about almost everything in his statist outlook. , Global warming, from which he made millions in carbon credits to his demagogic attacks on the rich over tax cuts,” a risky tax scheme” a mantra he repeated again and again. But even a wooden headed puppet occasionally gets it right. “Controlling Legal Authority” his defense for illegally fund raising from the White House was a wonderful descriptive phrase and without it Atlantis has no future.
The answer for many like the Seasteaders is to drift about in international waters free from interference and the heavy hand of government , not so according to their own consultants. At the Seasteading conference several years back a world class team addressed this matter and the news was grim. The experts pointed out that if anchored in a fixed location the justriction fell to the country controlling that chunk of sea floor or a treaty authority like the UN. If our new city was floating free it had to be a registered flag vessel of an existing nation and then comply with all the maritime regulations as would any other vessel.
The experts had a litany of issues that were well established international law insisting that just hanging out and hoping for autonomy was at best naive at worst foolish. Many at the conference expressed outrage and anger at this revelation , perhaps with moral justification but zero legal standing. So even if all the engineering issues could be overcome the bottom line is no Controlling Legal Authority.
After a fit of rebellion I trashed all the dersin concepts that in many ways resolved the high cost ,safety and expansion issues of a floating city and changed course, focusing instead on a firm legal foundation first and foremost. Whatever the plan it must have a proven track record and be able to survive the litigious challenges that would inevitably come at the first glimmer of the successful execution of Atlantis. by big brother and his acolytes.
The Happiest place on earth is the prototype my friends, yes Uncle Walt built the first theme park in Anaheim CA to the cat calls of the mob, it will never work they said as always but millions came and Disney Land quickly became a victim of it’s own success. Hotels and strip centers encircled the park like a strangler fig and the city of Anaheim turned from an ally to the enemy of the Disney company blocking it’s need for autonomy and expansion
Disney World just south of Orlando on the other hand vested Walt with all the power he needed to have Controlling Legal Authority over 27,000 acres of Florida swamp land.
The City of Lake Buena Vista was established by the State of Florida in the 60s giving it’s only resident , The Disney company, all the rights and responsibilities of a full blown city, construction permits, zoning, utilities, security, transportation, you name it Walt was in full control of his destiny and still,is today.
How did Disney get this authority from the state and how do corporatists do it today ie Tesla's battery factory was just awarded billions to build it’s deadly polluting lithium ion batteries in Nevada, it works every time it’s tried, that old libertarian concept, COMPETITION
In part 2 I will explain all the details of where how and when a new Atlantis is easily within our grasp if as Dr Strangelove said we have the “Will to do so”
Many of us chafe at the ever increasing grip Governments exert on their citizens
here in the US and around the world. The list ranges from the trivial like your toilet flush capacity or type of light bulb to the serious matters of choosing a doctor or school for the next generation. The list gets longer every day.
So if Atlantis is to offer any real relief it’s inhabitants must enjoy all the freedoms we have let slip away. “ In the public interest” they tell us. I see many forum comments on this subject each with a different spin on a new society but at the root of it all is the need to manifest a new destiny without big brothers help, for better or worse.
Al Gore, our oafish and misguided VP was wrong about almost everything in his statist outlook. , Global warming, from which he made millions in carbon credits to his demagogic attacks on the rich over tax cuts,” a risky tax scheme” a mantra he repeated again and again. But even a wooden headed puppet occasionally gets it right. “Controlling Legal Authority” his defense for illegally fund raising from the White House was a wonderful descriptive phrase and without it Atlantis has no future.
The answer for many like the Seasteaders is to drift about in international waters free from interference and the heavy hand of government , not so according to their own consultants. At the Seasteading conference several years back a world class team addressed this matter and the news was grim. The experts pointed out that if anchored in a fixed location the justriction fell to the country controlling that chunk of sea floor or a treaty authority like the UN. If our new city was floating free it had to be a registered flag vessel of an existing nation and then comply with all the maritime regulations as would any other vessel.
The experts had a litany of issues that were well established international law insisting that just hanging out and hoping for autonomy was at best naive at worst foolish. Many at the conference expressed outrage and anger at this revelation , perhaps with moral justification but zero legal standing. So even if all the engineering issues could be overcome the bottom line is no Controlling Legal Authority.
After a fit of rebellion I trashed all the dersin concepts that in many ways resolved the high cost ,safety and expansion issues of a floating city and changed course, focusing instead on a firm legal foundation first and foremost. Whatever the plan it must have a proven track record and be able to survive the litigious challenges that would inevitably come at the first glimmer of the successful execution of Atlantis. by big brother and his acolytes.
The Happiest place on earth is the prototype my friends, yes Uncle Walt built the first theme park in Anaheim CA to the cat calls of the mob, it will never work they said as always but millions came and Disney Land quickly became a victim of it’s own success. Hotels and strip centers encircled the park like a strangler fig and the city of Anaheim turned from an ally to the enemy of the Disney company blocking it’s need for autonomy and expansion
Disney World just south of Orlando on the other hand vested Walt with all the power he needed to have Controlling Legal Authority over 27,000 acres of Florida swamp land.
The City of Lake Buena Vista was established by the State of Florida in the 60s giving it’s only resident , The Disney company, all the rights and responsibilities of a full blown city, construction permits, zoning, utilities, security, transportation, you name it Walt was in full control of his destiny and still,is today.
How did Disney get this authority from the state and how do corporatists do it today ie Tesla's battery factory was just awarded billions to build it’s deadly polluting lithium ion batteries in Nevada, it works every time it’s tried, that old libertarian concept, COMPETITION
In part 2 I will explain all the details of where how and when a new Atlantis is easily within our grasp if as Dr Strangelove said we have the “Will to do so”
I am confused what this has to do with Competition. If you mean between states, then I doubt is will work, because the UN will be against allowing this sort of experiment.
You are correct that the US states offer no relief. the federal government is the problem and no state can resist it.ore protect us from it.
The UN is a big part of the problem as well but my plan will let us hide in plain site .with total control of our own future.
We are talking, by the way, about allodial title. You'd have to go to war to win that.
The attack would start with some scandal. A Gulch resident is exonerated by Gulch courts in the death of a US citizen who died in an accident, perhaps while engaging in risky behavior. The US gov't accuses the Gulch of harboring an accused murderer and of ongoing safety violations for allowing the risky behavior.
I hope I'm wrong and such scandals could be resolved without force.
just move into and overtake a country like Belize?
if you can buy a mansion there for $25k, the place
could be controlled by a Koch brother. -- j
on about 8, ourselves), and though it was rustic
and the roads were rough, it was impressive in
that the people speak english and their connection
with britain remains fairly healthy. . bet that Bill Gates
could buy it. -- j
p.s. I'm mighty glad that you are doing well
and staying in here with us!!!
This means that while AS is a good crucible in which the values of production vs parasitism is explored, it is not a model that can be used as a template in the 21st century. For example: there is nowhere on earth that a group of people cannot be observed, brought within legal bounds of some country (or UN jurisdiction) or other, and have military power brought to bear on them.
If Atlantis were successful, but not politically significant, then it would be the prey of pirates. If it became a significant power, then existing governments would vie for control of it. There is a very low bar to 'too unimportant to bother with' in the US (and in other countries as well) and that goal if obscurity is even harder to attain when you add 'and the community is composed of high-tech producers of value items'. Yes, a few hundred people in a pastoral Peruvian community can be 'under the radar'. What do you think would happen if there were 500,000 people in that community? What would happen if those people began thriving industries that resulted in new and profitable inventions? How would the next socialist Peruvian government respond to that?
I have read many plans for Atlantis, and none of them seem to me to be plausible. (What I am tending towards is a 'jump rope' opportunistic path...but that is still an early hypothesis.)
Jan
What started my cogitations on the 'jump rope' was reading (due to comments on this list months ago, ahem!) about the allodial ownership of property in Nevada (see wiki article:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allodial_title#Nevada). This opportunity took place between 1997 and 2005 (one cannot apply to own land allodially in Nevada since 2005). But - for a brief time - there was a window of opportunity there. Then, separately, I read about Rand Paul promoting low tax 'Economic Freedom' zones. And, of course, all of us know about the free towns of the ancient and medieval world.
On another topic, I sometimes amuse myself by looking on the net for other countries that are explicitly freer than the US (not just ones where you can be below the threshold of being noticed). No go. There is also a question that must be answered in locating Atlantis in a country (or in 'no' country): where can one live that Putin [insert name of bully of choice] will hesitate to send tanks to run over your garden fence?
So, putting this all together, here is the Jump Rope. Obviously, for a brief time in Nevada, there was a successful attempt to reclaim some lost freedoms. There are states in the US, such as Texas and Alaska, that are not as far along the socialist program as the rest of the country is. We _may_ even now be swinging back to a more conservative point on the political spectrum. When we get to a moment where the rope is swinging right and we think we can 'jump into the game' we may be able to get the legislature of a 'very red' state to establish 'Freedom Zones', within which the absence of regulation and tax-based services is exchanged for the freedom from (most) taxes. (There is precedent for this with respect to the Amish. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amish#Amis...)
We would have (and pay taxes for) the military protection of the US. But we would also have access to sales markets, technology, and personnel. Also important, were we successful, we would have access to Envy as our people prospered in comparison to the surrounding folk.
The advantage we have is that capitalism and freedom actually work. Socialism does not (though in an affluent society it may take a century to prove that).
That is the Jump Rope.
Jan
Not enough Galts,No place to hide, Pirates,government tale over, these are great points.
It just takes one Galt and a few others who get it. Lots of folk traveled the Oregon Trail, once the path was cleared.
Pirates are easy to handle with even a rudimentary security force.
Uncle Sam is another matter.
"A dangerous regime controlled by economic terrorists calling themselves objectivists"
(In case you can't tell, I agree with you on the defense issue.)
This is real to me as I see no happy ending given out current track, I hope I am wrong but hope is not a plan.
Take my love, take my land.
Take me where I cannot stand.
I don't care, I'm still free.
You can't take the sky from me.
Take me out to the black
Tell them I ain't comin' back
Burn the land and boil the sea
You can't take the sky from me.
Leave the men where they lay
They'll never see another day
Lost my soul, lost my dream
You can't take the sky from me.
I feel the black reaching out
I hear its song without a doubt
I still hear and I still see
That you can't take the sky from me.
Lost my love, lost my land
Lost the last place I could stand
There's no place I can be
Since I've found Serenity
And you can't take the sky from me.
Haven't put either in the DVD player as yet, but I've already seen both on TV.
http://www.ozmirage.org/anic/?p=224
When has there ever been legal support to create a new country? Never.
Expecting legal support is nothing more than an admission by a planted NWO supporter that they won't approve it. Big surprise!
We have the same rights to a separate country that Jefferson described in the Declaration of Independence.
If we aren't willing to plan and fight for it, we won't get it and don't deserve it.
No one is going to hand freedom over to us.
The challenge is to find the way that is least likely to result in military action against us.
No country is going to hand over any land that they control, and no country in the world has the small government that we desire. So picking one and spending hundreds of millions after getting permission from them is nothing but surrender to dictatorship.
Willing to pledge your life, fortune, and sacred honor?